Kemp got blacklisted b/c of his drug abuse (remember, Stern was trying to keep a squeaky clean image of the league post-Jordan). I agree he should be in it and that Amare shouldn’t have been a first ballot candidate.

EDIT – Amar’e wasn’t first ballot.

He left Seattle and stopped taking his body seriously, destroying his athleticism. He pretty much could’ve retired after leaving Seattle.

I believe he’ll make it in the next 7-8 years though.

Part of it is the “good citizen of the game” tax, combined with Amare having a different kind of celebrity. 

Amare ingratiated himself with the business and fashion communities in NYC and so got a bigger public profile than previously, and didn’t do anything to embarrass himself.

Unfortunately Shawn Kemp has had a lot of drug/alcohol/legal issues.

Kemp got tossed out of college (UK) for stealing from the coaches kid. He had horrible off the court issues. Then he left as a fat joke of a player. None of this might matter to the stats you are showing, but the accumulation of these issues is exactly why.

I mean, it’s quite simple. Kemp isn’t an Israeli Basketball Premier League Finals MVP like Stoudamire is. That plus the two Israeli Basketball Premier League championships really tipped him over the edge

They really aren’t that close.

Amare averaged 18.⁹⁄₇.8 Kemp averaged 14.⁶⁄₈.4

Amare shot 53.7% Kemp shot 48.8%

Kemp’s career was free of major injuries while Amare’s was not. There is no “what could have been” with Kemp.

Kemp averaged 20 ppg one season vs Amare doing it 6 seasons.

Amare’s decline was largely due to injuries. Kemp’s decline was largely due to overeating.

Hopefully he should be. But his off court issues has really taken a toll on public perception towards him, I know it shouldn’t affect his HOF status but it does realistically.

Amar’e has 5 All NBA selections. Every single player with 5 All NBA selections that isn’t a pedophile is in the hall of fame.

Kemps accolades are not equal or better. Stoudemire won ROY and had more All NBA selections than Kemp. Cool dunks is not an accolade, sorry nostalgia fans.

They’re both “Hall of very Good” IMHO

I used to love watching Shawn kemp dunk highlight reel videos on YouTube back in the day. I also thought he was one of the more under-appreciated players of that time. 

Amare had great years. I was excited when Knicks signed him. But I don’t think he’s a great hall of fame choice.

Amare averaged damn near 30 a game one year and was an mvp candidate on the Knicks. His HOF candidacy is debatable but he’s 100% better than Shawn Kemp

Amare should spend a significant portion of his speech dedicated to the greatness of Steve Nash.

How about neither should be in the HOF. The bar is too low and the achievement doesn’t mean much anymore.

PR diff

His last 3 seasons really brought down his career averages and showed he was a shell of himself. He also averaged 20+ ppg once in his career I think? I think he ultimately never got the look because of his choices. The league had a pretty strong run of HOF the last 20 years but recently (and much earlier)classes had been weaker imo

The NBA HOF is way too inclusive first of all.

If I had it my way, Amare is not in the HOF.

This is a good example of when a player averages more points and gets a little more shine. Pretty even overall but Amare got more attention for scoring more. And like others have said off the court Kemp’s image wasn’t as clean as Amare’s. It should be about on the court but off the court stuff does have an impact on perceptions.

Neither should be HOFers

I was shocked he wasn’t in the Hall of Fame. 1991 until like 1998 he was as big a star as you get. That was my perception. 

Shawn Kemp has always been my baseline of “well, if he can’t get in, nobody with a lesser resume should ever think of it”.

That being said, I feel like he probably should be let in, downfall of his career notwithstanding.

Amare should not be in the HOF. That’s the answer.

This “lead team to finals” isn’t a good argument. Different context and time, the west during Amare tine with Phoenix was much stronger. Dude had 37 ppg against prime Duncan!!!

I think Kemp will get in eventually. I think the off court issues that caused his rapid decline really negatively affected his candidacy to a lot of people

Nba first team really helps as does rookie of the year. Amare has a bronze too in the Olympics. 5 years of a top 10 player vs 3 matters the most.

The big Yahu made a call for Amar’e, neither should really be in tbh

Because he has become the model of what not to do off the court. Dont have multiple kids with multiple women, dont eat away your athleticism.

He still had a long career but he pissed away many prime years because of his off court lifestyle

guess who just watched shawn kemps seattle highlights for the first time?

I’d be ok with Kemp getting in but to be fair Amar’e was an All-League player for longer and had his overseas career as well.

Amar’e also peaked as one of the best playoff scoring runs of all time. One of just 5 players to his 30+ pp/75 on 10+ rTS% through a postseason run playing 300+ minutes in 2005.. LeBron (twice), Kawhi, KD, and Kareem being the only others. And it you filter it by more minutes only he and LeBron have hit that playing 600+ minutes (deep post season run rather than early exit).

I doubt that was part of the consideration for making the HOF, but people that watched the 2005 playoffs likely have some form of “eye test” to acknowledge he was a freak that year.

It really comes down to how their primes ended. Amar’e’s body broke down because of brutal knee and eye injuries, so voters view his shortened peak with sympathy.

PR.

If Kemp stays in shape and adds five seasons to his career at a high level, he’s a no doubter.

I’m not sure either of them belong, to be honest. I think Amare is a great example of how everyone gets in the HOF.

That being said, the way Kemp’s career petered out left a bad taste in everyone’s mouth, and probably caused people to retroactively discount how good he actually was when he was good.

But “this other guy who probably shouldn’t be there is in the HOF, so my guy should be,” is a logic that really needs to be thrown away.

OP, I have a thought experiment for you…

• Suppose Player A makes the cut and is entered into the Hall of Fame.
• But Player B is “just a little bit worse” than Player A. If you argue Player B should make it as well, then…
• What about Player C, who is just a little bit worse than Player B?

We must draw the line somewhere.

I’m not an Amare hater at all.

But, when I saw he was in the HOF?

I was shocked.

I believe being inducted into any HOF should be a no-brainer.

Shouldn’t have questions. Any reasonable person would agree with their induction.

Talking Jordan or Bron or Magic or Bird or Shaq or Wilt.

Amare gets into that “should he be a HOFer?” discussion.

Which is my cutoff point.

If you have to question it, then no.

But, I do the HOF is also a TV event.

Agreed. Had no idea Amare was in Hall of Fame.

Here’s a better one. How is Amare a HOFer yet Shawn Marion is not? Despite Marion have a clearly better career. Amare being in the HOF is a joke. Marion NOT being in the HOF is also a joke. Makes zero sense.

There’s been 466 different all-stars in NBA history. We’ve inducted 436 people. Everyone will eventually make the HOF. IMO, they should not induct a new class annually.

Plus there’s the Latrell Sprewell sympathy factor to take in account for Shawn Kemp. The man has children to feed (eleven kids from nine women to be exact).

Because there are unknown committees who vote people in. It’s completely subjective. He might eventually make it though.

Edit: typo

Honestly could see a world where he gets inducted the first year Seattle has a team since the momentum of the sonics returning could put some pressure on the HOF voters

Side note I wish there was an NBA Hall of Fame

Amare successfully converted to judaism. They need representation.

You know what? I think Kemp might have been a more skilled player than Amare. 

Here he is in the playoffs beating a stacked 1998 Pacers team that took Michael and Scottie to 7. Mind you, this is after his athletic prime: 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nX97bJNxo3s&pp=ygUiU2hhd24ga2VtcCBjYXZzIHBhY2VycyBwbGF5b2ZmIHdpbg%3D%3D&ra=m

There’s just a lot to his game here and he’s THE guy on this Cavs playoff team. Not sure I’ve ever seen Amare be that guy. 

Here’s what’s crazy - the Cavs lose this series, the lockout comes, and Kemp blows up to 315 pounds! 

Even crazier than that - he actually has a good lockout season, playing almost every game and finishing 11th in MVP voting. 

I think we all watch the SuperSonics dunking highlights and we forget we are talking about a very skilled basketball player. 

After all, the dude grew up in Indiana. What would you expect? 

Off court behavior, PR.

6x all-star are almost always HOFers.

• Adrian Dantley
• Joe Dumars
• Tiny Archibald
• Derozan (future lock)
• Pau Gasol
• Connie Hawkins

I totally agree with you. Very similar players with very similar effects on the league. I was a big fan of both of them–myself, as a slow 6-0 dude who couldn’t jump, they played with athleticism, explosiveness, and style that I could only dream of. 

Like others said, I think there were a lot things going on in Kemp’s personal life that made him less attractive as a candidate to nominate for the HOF.

Are we talking about American Israeli NBA player Amare Stoudamire?

Found Dirk’s burner account.

Kemp’s career flamed out because he was an alcoholic who did drugs. He also got really fat as an athlete. As a Blazer fan, Kemp was pretty embarrassing by the time he joined the team. He kind of looked like Grimace from McDonald’s. Stoudamire’s body brokedown and he was never a bad citizen(meaning he never had 7 children with 6 different women and the child support issues that go along with that level of progeny. At the time the drinking and drug problems developed as Kemp had more baby mommas wanting their slice of the pie). I would expect Kemp to get in at some point because the Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame has a pretty low threshold for inclusion.

It’s because Amare has two Israel league championships.

Amare generated 1650 points above league average TS% for his usage.

Kemp generated 680.

This made me wonder so I looked- Kemp did get inducted into the Indiana basketball hall of fame. I think he will I to the NBA too. Better player than AS imo.

Dude went full Grand Theft Auto in a mall parking lot and legit uncovered a property theft ring. HOF in my book

Doesn’t look great on paper. Elton Brand had better stats

I’m happy to see A’mare in the HoF, I didn’t think he’d make it this soon on his 7th try.

I felt he was always a borderline HOF case, where his career in Israeli might eventually push him in. I also know this isn’t going to fly with some people, but considering he came straight out of high school and achieved instant success should’ve weigh heavily.  

The first HS ROY NBA player.  Is quite an accomplishment. Especially, when the narrative has often been that American HS players are completely ill-equipped.

He also had 4 top ten MVP finishes with 6x All Star selections on top of 5x All NBA.

No NBA championships, but once again it’s a team accomplishment more so than individual accomplishment though the outliers it can become an individual achievement for the GOAT level players.

His accomplishments are about the standard for pro players who make the HOF.    6x pro bowler/5x all pro is quite a few NFL players who made the HOF, a few MLB players only reached 6x all star games and were inducted.  Still nothing is too crazy.

I grew up wanting to be Shawn Kemp.

He fried his own career and went out sad.

He’ll probably get in eventually but the difference between his early playing days and his Golden Corral days… crazy tbh.

Because Amare Stoudamire was waaay better than Shawn Kemp.

Why isnt Bonds in thr HoF?

It’s close, but Amar’e was a better overall player and did shape basketball outside of his NBA career (basically extended his career and reach)

I think the only way Kemp gets to HOF is if Seattle gets a team back and Kemp coaches or contributes to basketball in some way

Such a low hurdle for the HOF…who’s next? DeRozan? Mitchell? Lowry? Love? Gobert? Horford? Weak sauce

Kemp career statline:

PTS 14.6 REB 8.4 AST 1.6 FG% 48.8

Amare career statline:

PTS 18.9 REB 7.8 AST 1.2 FG% 53.7

I’m not necessarily saying one should be in while the other shouldn’t, but framing is as “slightly better” by comparing the things that seem equivalent while ignoring a major discrepancy in statistical impact, and then also focusing on random team stuff seems pretty disingenuous to the argument.

If you think Kemp should be in argue for Kemp to be in. Don’t argue for him to be similar or favorable to Amare for things like his TEAM reaching the Finals and winning some games. That isn’t a Kemp accomplishment that’s a Sonics team accomplishment.

He’s better than other players in the hall of fame. Best player on a finals team and played for team USA. 3rd best power forward of the 90s. Amare wasn’t as good

Very similar careers. When both kemp and stoudamire left their main teams that was pretty much the end for them and both played about the same amount of years too. The Basketball HOF is so damn weak that they should just let kemp in. I mean Kyle Lowry is gonna get in, was that guy ever a top 15 player in the league ever? Nope. We should let in Zach Randolph atp there’s a dawg that had a similar career to Lowry.

I think we’re also going to see this with Antoine Walker. Theres going to be someone who gets in with a injury shortened career that ends up with similar numbers to Walker (NCAA champ, 3x all star l, 4x 20+ scorer, NBA title as role player) and people are going to start asking why Antoine never made the hall.

If he kept in shape and didn’t have a terrible off-couet reputation then maybe he would be

Amare being there just destroys the future credibility of the hall of fame

I think Stoudemire’s success in Israel helped him make the HOF. Kemp’s career was basically over by 31.

Shawn Kemp was a clear number 2 guy on the Sonics while Amare was more of a 1b kind of player on the Suns.

Neither belong, really.Amare, i dunno how he got in, maybe cuz he’s Jewish?