Michael Jordan being called the GOAT when he had 0-1 rings.
Bobby Knight said Michael Jordan was the best basketball player he’d ever seen play, before Jordan was even in the NBA.
Larry Bird called Jordan god in Jordan’s 2nd season
The primary knock on Jordan was just that he hadn’t won a championship yet. Then he 3peated, something nobody had done since the merger. Then he 3peated again
That was Bird’s 3rd consecutive MVP year, about to win his third championship, had every accolade possible, was being talked about as maybe being the GOAT, conceded nothing to anyone… it was THAT Bird who called Jordan “God”, saying that Jordan did things he’s never seen done before, things he hadn’t thought were possible.
Real recognize real
Philosophically, there was a mindset that you couldn’t win a title with a dominant wing scorer. Magic had Kareem as was seen as a passer as much as a scorer, although clearly he could have scored more if he wanted to. Bird had McHale, and was a “forward” - played closer to the basket.
And to be fair, Phil Jackson put a lot of energy into trying to get Jordan to shoot less, to the point of calling a timeout in the finals to ask him “who’s open?”
But yeah, in the late ‘80s, it went from being “Magic and Bird” to “Magic and Bird and Michael” even though Jordan hadn’t won a title yet.
this mf came in the league averaging 28, then put up 37 per game in his third season and 35 in his fourth season.
I think everyone knew he was the best player to ever touch a basketball at the time in the literal sense of the word, not the greatest since he didn’t have the achievements to back it up, but they probably confused the two as a lot of people do.
I “confuse” the two intentionally
I have this conversation with fellow Celtic fans about the “greatest Celtics ever” you really have to specify if you’re talking talent vs accolades. Often, out of frustration over people ranking Paul Pierce in their Mount Rushmore ahead of guys like John Havlicek.
If you accept that the game is constantly evolving, the sport has grown in popularity astronomically, the development pathway is exponentially more advanced, and players are constantly getting better and better, you really can’t pretend a player like 1950s Bob Cousy could go toe to toe with someone like Payton Pritchard.
This pisses off basketball historians and is seen as disrespectful to the prior generations, but it’s just basic logic. When Bob was learning the game in the 40s, there were maybe 5-15 million people who were playing basketball recreationally in a global population of 2.3 billion, whereas today it’s something like 650+ million in a global population of 8.1. And the infrastructure is just completely different. In the 1940s you couldn’t walk into a random gym or outdoor court anywhere in America and have a competitive basketball game. There were schools that didn’t even have courts. I’m sure some of those young men in the 40s brought portable hoops when stationed overseas for World War 2, but what are we even talking about here? There was no blueprint for Cousy. He taught himself how to play. There were no skills trainers, dribble-goggles, film analysis, nothing. His early development would have been hyper localized in New York city schools and catholic youth orgs. On the flipside, a modern player like Pritchard had dedicated skills coaches from a young age. Every movement, from high-rep heavy-ball dribbling drills to 30 foot step-backs was intentionally taught and perfected via repetitions before he even hit high school. He had access to a unlimited footage where he could break down things frame by frame for someone like Steph Curry’s footwork or Kyrie’s handles. By age 12, Pritchard was flying across North America to play elite shoe-circuit tourneys and facing future NBA lotto picks every single weekend in high-pressure enviornments. Before he even stepped foot on a college campus, Pritchard games were live-streamed.
So once you cross that bridge that, obviously, being one of the top players in an 9-team 1950s NBA is extremely different than a modern player being one of the top 50 players in the entire world of 8+ billion where nearly a billion people play basketball recreationally, you can start to accept that this is true of every era to a lesser extreme. The game is constantly improving. If i’m doing a “all-Celtic” draft picking every player in their prime, I’m probably taking 1986 Larry Bird #1 just because he was otherworldly and would succeed in modern times, but in all honesty I’m probably taking 2024 Jayson Tatum #2, probably taking 2008 Kevin Garnett #3. Guys like Pierce and Jaylen Brown might be worthy of top 5 in that conversation. Frankly, you probably also have to consider 2019 Kyrie Irving with one of the top picks, as much as that disgusts my fellow Celtic fans. If the convo is talent, slanting modern (with some exceptions) just makes sense. Russell was an athletic freak (though only around 6’9 220) who maybe doesn’t dominate modern basketball, but I’m thinking his defensive instincts and will to win likely would have been translated even if it looked more like Ben Wallace in modern times.
But if we’re talking accolades, it’s an entirely different conversation. There’s numerous players like Russell, Cousy, etc that have a more impressive awards resume than someone like Paul Pierce. John Havlicek was a 13 all-star, multiple 1st team all-nba and 1st team all-defense in the 1970s. You can debate whether 1970s basketball was close enough to 2000s ball that Havlicek was a basketball player than Pierce (who was only 2nd team once), but if you’re comparing resume it’s a ridiculous conversation. Hondo was an 8x champion had a FMVP (would have had more but they didn’t invent that award until 1969), 11x all-nba, 8x all-defense. Obviously accolades you can’t pretend Pierce’s single FMVP award puts him in that conversation. He’d rank behind guys like Sam Jones, Tom Heinsohn, and others.
So anyways, yeah I think you could absolutely have said in the late 80s that Jordan was arguably the single greatest talent we’d seen. And yes, I think it’s defensible to say that LeBron, even without 6 titles, was possibly a greater talent than Jordan. You have to separate if the conversation is just counting awards or talking about actual basketball skill.
Assuming the top of the top players in the past had today’s training, I think they would still be very successful. Drive to win and basketball IQ are still super important and that 50-60s Celtics team had that in spades. Russell, Cousy, Havlicek retrained with modern methods would still be top tier. Russell was vomiting our of sheer anxiety after lots of games.
Still is
In a similar way I think a lot of people might agree that Wemby is the best defender we’ve ever seen, but he’s not the defensive GOAT yet.
He wasn’t the first overall pick in the draft.
Imagine the outrage had they glazed LeBron like this 😅
LeBron was literally called the chosen one. Good thing he live up to his hype.
>LeBron was literally called the chosen one.
When he was a junior in HS, a full year and a half before playing his first NBA game. (They lost)
Lebron was glazed like this.
They played lebron’s high school games on ESPN
You mean the highschool kid they called “The Chosen One”? The high school kid who got his games on ESPN. The most hyped up draft pick of all time?
No they would never glaze Bron.
There were people literally glazed LeBron like this since he stepped into the league.
You think there wasn’t criticism on MJ like “he can score but he can’t win rings”“he can’t make his teammate better like Bird/Magic” back in the days before he shuts everyone up with two threepeats?
He was. Guessing you weren’t born yet when he was drafted.
No knock to the yoots.
He has called himself King James since high school. His logo as a rookie had a crown in it…lmfao. Dude was on the cover of SI in high school and they showed his HS games live on ESPN. Is that enough glazing for you?
LeBron might be the most glazed athlete in world history.
sir, this is the one example where they did. He was selling our arenas as a sophomore in HS
You’re the most embarrassing type of simpleton it’s possible to be
I do remember this and I think about it every time the topic comes up and everyone now wants to wait for a career to be over before judgment. It’s funny.
Sports discourse has never played by logical rules.
Sometimes you just have to trust your eyes and gut
Though that will often lead you to feeling bloated and depressed as you stare at an empty pizza box while fighting off a food coma.
Two points is not two points
was kareem a consensus goat before that then?
Reminds me of Federer in tennis. You can find clips from like 2004 when he only had a couple slam titles and pundits were already convinced he was the best player the sport had ever seen.
Man this is why I can’t just see Djokovic as the GOAT of tennis. Yes he’s won more. He’s had an amazingly long career. He’s still one of the best in the world at an age when most would retire. He’s like the Lebron of tennis.
Federer is so similar to Jordan in the sense that there was this magical level of play from a very early stage of his career which translated into unprecedented dominance on the court.
I don’t know who would that make Nadal though. Probably still similar to LeBron.
Yeah…i guess that’s how I see it… tennis has one MJ and that’s Fed and 2 LeBrons in Djokovic and Nadal (not a knock on either of them in any way as obviously Lebron is up there with MJ… Just a planck length below him).
Personality wise Federer is the opposite of MJ though lol
Federer was quite the sore loser when things didn’t go his way. The “classy guy” thing was just Rolex marketing
Well I would argue Federers peak from 2004-2008 was probably the highest peak we have ever seen in tennis and probably ever will.
The actual peak of all tennis is Rafa at Roland Garros. But yea in terms of sustained dominance across multiple years, that 04-08 stretch was absurd.
No way. Djokovic 2011 and 2015 was unplayable. Federer feasted on insanely weak competition in 2004-2007 (and yes Novak too during the pandemic). But Novak was god like where Federer began to look more and more human with the rise Djokovic and nadal. Federer was amazing but I’d even have Rafa over him. Federer was just first out of the 3, but Djokovic turning defense into offense on the fly was beyond amazing
Jordan is Jordan because he has no peers, Federer has a losing head to head and is even 0-3 vs Novak in Wimbledon. That’s the beauty of tennis, we saw the top 3 all play at the same time. And it’s not a team sport. That’s why Djokovic’s goat is far easier to make than most players from team sports
Agree with you. I like Federer more but it’s no debate - Novak is the best of all time.
Same for me as a huge Rafa guy. At a certain point I just had to accept that Novak is the GOAT
Yeah I can’t disagree with anything you stated. Like I said I view Novak as the Lebron of tennis which is absolutely not a diss against him. Just my opinion at the end of it.
Great points about all 3 of the playing at the same time and tennis being an individual sport!
Just an extra info out there Djokovic is currently 39 years old and ranked 5th in the world.
Federer was ranked 4th when he turned 39.
The difference here is that Djokovic had to take the crown from Federer and Nadal like MJ had to from Bird and Magic.
it’s all subjective my guy
some people think brons the goat, some people think jordan’s the goat
shit some people probably think frank kaminsky iii is the goat, just enjoy hoops
Both teams played hard type of comment
I just hope both teams had fun
Hey Russ, how you been
This is a hot take in this sub.
Paul Pierce is the goat.
I miss GoZ
Yao Ming is the goat.
I go back and forth between Frank, Ethan Happ, and Michael Finley. Badgers > Goats.
Frank kaminski won NCAA player of the year as many times as LeBron and MJ combined
Francisco Garcia is the GOAT.
Greatest Dominican player in Kings history
jemerrio jones*
My choice is Kristaps Porziņģis
I’d say Kevin Pittsnoggle is the GOAT 🐐 🙌🏾
What? You don’t like this needless back and forth about players rather than enjoying the game. That’s ridiculous.
Also, you’re wrong anyway, we all know Corey Brewer and Terrence Ross are tied for GOAT
Idk how you can say it’s “Subjective” when people were never saying this about LeBron when he was playing and I was there to see LeBron whole career
I don’t remember a time a announcer, commentator ever considered LeBron to be the greatest of all time his 1st 7 years in the league
It’s just not true
Jordan never had to compare to Jordan, and LeBron did
That’s fair, but Jordan did have to compete with Russell, 11 rings in 13 years, and 1969 wasn’t that far away from 1989. I’m biased. My take is that if LeBron had won 4 chips over the past 20 years and then Jordan came in and strangled the league with 2 3-peats, all the MVPs, All-Defense teams, etc., I still think Jordan would be given the edge, even playing in Bron’s shadow. But this is all wild speculation.
People act like Jordan wasn’t competing with Russell’s 11 rings, Wilt’s 30.1 career scoring average, Kareem’s 6 MVPs and 6 rings, or against the fact that Magic+Bird had saved the NBA from dying as a league.
Bill Russell was considered the GOAT on the NBA’s 35th year anniversary team btw. And that vote took place after Kareem had won his 6th league MVP, surpassing the tie he had with Bill Russell at 5. Then the all time teams/lists stopped naming anybody the GOAT and also stopped putting them in order to avoid any of this nonsense lol
If people did this for Lebron, it would get called glazing
Didn’t Bron come out of high school with “the chosen one” as a nickname? They were hyping him back then too lol
Yeah and that still makes Jordan fans mad to this day. We just gotta all take a chill pill sometimes, history repeats itself and nothing is ever all that serious
Yeah, chosen successor to Jordan.
He got that shit tattooed and then started referring to himself as king James lol
It would have been cringey as fuck except he is actually him and lived up to the hype.
King James goes hard though.
Chris Paul is the Point God. Nothing wrong with that either.
Nothing wrong with referring to yourself as a king. It’s not like he was treating everybody else like peasants or something
They did tho plus I see people say this about wemby right now.
Nobody called LeBron the GOAT after the 2012 finals and neither did they for Wemby for serious.
Yeah because the 2011 NBA Finals happened lmfao
Acting like Jordan wasn’t getting bullied in the east for years before he made the finals
If Michael Jordan averaged 17ppg in a playoff series and got outscored by Jason Terry he wouldn’t have been considered the GOAT either. But of course that never happened, because he never choked a fat one like a certain somebody did
It took LeBron as long to make an NBA finals as it took Michael Jordan to win a playoff series in an era with fewer teams and only needing 3 wins
Lebron stans are so ashamed of 2011 they try to deflect by bringing up a different season where Lebron also didn’t win a championship LMAO
Yeah because one guy got to play in a historically weak conference while the other was playing all time great teams in Round 1 lol. Or are you actually dumb enough to think Lebron James is beating Larry Bird and the Celtics stacked full of Hall of Famers with Orlando Woolridge as his second best player?
Fewer teams means more talent because there are literally less players making the cut. What are you doing here? Just say you love Lebron and move on, there’s nothing you can say.
Fewer players worldwide also means a smaller player pool and worse quality of player. No I do not love LeBron I just don’t like delusional Jordan fans that can’t let go of the past.
What? That’s not an “also” thats literally opposite of what I said. You act like he played in the 60s. The MEDIAN salary for the NBA in 1991, Jordan’s first championship, was $650,000 a year. You understand you’re getting the best in the world at that price even now right?
Your takes were just wrong, idc who you’re a fan of.
Because Jordan was playing in the strongest conference of his era and getting knocked out of the Playoffs by the Dynasty Celtics or the two time champion Pistons
LeBron also got knocked out by the champions, except it happened in the Finals. But for some reason, people hold it against him but not against Jordan for not even making the Finals in the first place.
People hold LeBron choking in 2011 against him because he’s the reason his team lost that series. Any normal non Bron hater doesn’t count the Warrior’s or Spurs losses against him
Never is crazy, Jordan only played 6 years apparently.
Michael Jordan played in 37 career playoff series. His lowest scoring series he ever had was 26.6ppg, which last time I checked is more than 17, but you’re welcome to consult some other people if this is giving you trouble. Jordan also was the highest scoring player in 36 of his 37 career playoff series, the only time he wasn’t was his first ever playoff series as a rookie, when he averaged 29.3ppg to Terry Cummings 29.5ppg.
Lebron James’ 17ppg in the 2011 NBA Finals were 5th most in the series and 3rd most on his own team. Lebron was already a 2x MVP, considered the best player in the world, and the Heat were the NBA’s #1 team by net rating in 2011. And Lebron did that.
I know facts are hard for Lebron stans so go get an adult to help you guys if you’re still having trouble understanding why Lebron in 2012 wasn’t perceived the same way lmfao
Statswise he wasn’t though
They never did this with LeBron. The narrative with him young was always him chasing MJ. You would hear some commentators say “potentially the greatest player to ever play the game” and that didn’t start until after he broke the scoring record very late into his career.
Lol that’s bs. LeBron even said he is the goat because he beat the warriors.
We’re talking about what the media says about the player. Not what the player has said to the media. Nobody was calling LeBron the greatest player to ever play during his first stint in Cleveland. It was always about him chasing Jordan.
The later years of Cavs were much further than LeBron chasing MJ. It was a lot of LeBron vs MJ who’s the goat kind of Convo. It certainly was a lot earlier than he had the most point.
Dude why you keep twisting the words of all my comments?? I said his FIRST STINT in Cleveland. And the reason why I said that is because it’s what relates to the above video the most. And no people weren’t crowning him as the GOAT during his SECOND stint in Cleveland like you said because at the start of that he only had 2 rings.
You literally said he didn’t get that until he got the scoring record in your original post.
That’s not the comment you replied to though. You replied to the one with me talking about his 1st Cleveland stint and you brought up the 2nd one. And either way it goes you’re still wrong. No one was saying he was better than MJ when he only had 2 rings.
But comparing him to the goat isn’t that different from “some people tell me he’s the goat.”
That means you’re asking the same question.
Nobody said glazing when LeBron was coming out of high school but everyone expected him to be incredible. He had huge press before he ever got to the NBA.
Yeah. That’s how great he was.
Paul George is the real GOAT
FACTS 😤
I gotta hope this is true
“Some people have said to me he’s the greatest…”
Yeah and some people on Reddit still say it. He was also called a loser who can’t win a championship early on, before Scottie Pippen emerged as a top 20 all time player. Does that make it true? I watched basketball at the time, people said Wilt Chamberlin was the best also. People say things.
No one called him “a loser who can’t win a championship,” they said, “transcendent player stuck on bad teams.”
Right or wrong, fair or not, Jordan was perceived as always having strong postseason showings even when his team lost in 4, while LeBron was perceived early on as occasionally shrinking under the spotlight when it counted, even when his team would go to 7 games.
If I remember, Red Auerbach, who’s seen some shit, listed him as one of the best playoff players/players he’d choose in a playoff all time, before he even won a ring.
“You had all your media naysayers: ‘Scoring champion can’t win an NBA title.’ ‘You’re not as good as Magic Johnson, not as good as Larry Bird. You’re good but you’re not as good as those guys.’ I had to listen to this every day.” - Michael Jordan quote.
I know people who want to follow a narrative and are too young maybe to remember, but I remember when he was called a loser who could only win scoring titles but was too selfish to win a title. That’s literally what the triangle was, it was to get Jordan to pass the ball. Luckily he passed to a player who was one of the other top 10 players of that generation.
But hey, Jordan and I remember what it was like, but you go ahead and create whatever fantasy gets you by.
They had announcers saying ts and people think wemby hype too crazy lmao
You also have to remember that this was pre-internet and people didn’t endlessly debate who the GOAT was.
Meanwhile Reddit nephews call LeBron the goat after a 4-6 finals record
I mean he looked like he would be the clear GOAT if he would continue to play like that, which he did.
Who knew that a genetic monster like LeBron was coming in later
Just a shame there may be a lot more memories of him conceding titles to other players but he’s one hell of a player. Even for all the amazing finals runs he’s had I remember him as the ultimate runner up
He was an underdog in a majority of his final matchups
Something that gets overlooked is Pippen was on a shit deal. He was basically signed to todays MLE and it allowed the Bulls to put a hall of fame roster around Jordan. Give Lebron Prime Tatum or Cunningham on the MLE while the team builds the rest of the roster. Shoot, put Bosh or Wade on the MLE and see what the Heat do with the rest of the cap. Then well see how many titles Bron cranks out in a row. He definitely gets more than 6.
Jordan gets a lot of praise and rightfully so but he also had a lot of things heavily in his favor that made him successful and seeing how Brons career has played out it there is a zero valid argument where Jordan is greater than Lebron as an all time great.
Great reminder that it’s a team sport. I think MJ in the 90’s really fucked people’s heads up. MJ was also MJ in the 80’s and never even sniffed the Finals.
When you are seeing such God given ability combined with skill and unmatched competitiveness at such a young age against a championship caliber team. Whatever imaginations we had for his career he went and blew the roof off that.
Keep in mind it’s not like they had never heard of him either, he was an ncaa champion + player of the year, so these guys all had some grounding in saying that and not just a prisoner of the moment type thing.
LeBron carrying that terrible early cavs team, and Wemby this year were the only comparable feelings for me, that at that moment, I could be watching the best to ever do it.
The pre champ NHL comparison to Connor McDavid is a good one I think. Where you see a guy that has all the natural ability combined with incredible skill. Here’s hoping he can get over the hump!
The problem with GOAT rankings/discussion is the criteria threshold is all over the place. Who was the better basketball player?, the better winner? , the most longevity? etc. Personally I think best of all time and greatest of all time are two different discussions. Kareem deserves more pub in discussions either way even though to me he isn’t number 1.
Kareem had a much bigger case before LeBron tbh, LeBron has basically taken Kareem’s whole case for goat and improved on it. A lot of the time when people call Michael the goat, it doesn’t even seem like they’re talking about him as a player, they’re talking about his legacy. So it’s just a frustrating discussion. Comparing great players between eras is hard enough even if there was common ground with the metrics of greatness we’re using
Jordan and LeBron would be top 2 in all these categories(best,greatest,winner) other than longevity
MJ and LeBron are my GOATs but best winner is Bill Russell. LeBron and Kareem are right there for longevity and accolades. Basically people introduce whatever criteria they want to back up their argument.
I don’t think anyone compare to what Anthony Bennet decomplished.
The acronym GOAT wasn’t even being used yet in 1992.
Looking forward to the Jokic edits in 40 years with the clip of SVG calling Jokic the GOAT being in it
Watch “Come Fly with me” filmed before he ever won a ship and theyre calling him the greatest. he was just that good.
GREATEST EVER….has time stopped? I hate the GOAT debate case all records will be broken. Its the impact that you made in your generation ..just hard facts.
My exact response when someone tells me someone else is the love of their life
This confirmed that he was marketed and predestinef by the powers that be to be the GOAT.
at that time there was no one more entertaining to watch, he transcended everything happening with the game and made little kids have something to want to be. before MJ and the media world that built up around we had a Magic Johnson how to play basketball tape. Once MJ came around things like Inside Stuff and Space Jam started to happen. when will you pathetic nephews give it up
Lol different time different standards
Premature in both instances. That first threepeat made him deserving. Before that it may have been true, but he didn’t win when it mattered. Greatness is defined by finding a way to get it done. Especially in a sport in which one player can be so influencial in winning or losing
It’s the clear that they meant it as the greatest talent to ever play basketball to that point. There had been greater careers and success before him but no one had seen someone so talented and with so much potential until him.
Nowadays the talent pool is a lot bigger and you have five more decades of previous basketball history so obviously it’s a lot harder to make those claims for a player so early in their career. In the 80’s and early 90’s it made sense
Nah. Wilt was also leagues ahead of his competition. By a bigger gap than Jordan. And in the late 80s the knock on Jordan was the same as the knock on Wilt. Great individual player but can’t get it done.
I’m team Jordan but it is kind of silly not to call out people that are not realistic about Jordan’s legacy. Jordan’s status as the GOAT is cemeted in 1991, 1993 or 1996 depending on who you ask at the time. Only by 1996 - 1997 season is no one doubting it. 97 and 98 rings only add to it.
Well at the end of the day you’re arguing your opinion against what people back then were saying, I’m just stating the thought process they had
[deleted]
Did you mean to respond to someone else? I’m an MJ guy lol. I literally just said the first three-peat made him the GOAT.
Sport wasn’t that popular back then. It didn’t have as much discussion around it as it does now. Calling a current player the GOAT definitely helps sell tickets and drama.
People don’t truly realize how much better Jordan was than his peers. I was a little too young to truly understand it. That’s Michael Jordan’s GOAT case. As great as Wilt was, even his gap wasn’t that huge (look at his playoff numbers).
Wilt’s gap with his peers was way crazier, I don’t think there’s any comparison. MJ had monster playoff performances but Wilt did it game to game
Crazy statement. Wilt as an overall athlete was as ahead of his time as anyone we have ever seen in sports.
It’s because he was the best player in the world
Wemby was the best player in the world this year, especially in the playoffs, but since he didn’t win the title people will naturally push back on it
It’s not yet clear that Wemby is the best in the world, there’s just an increasingly defensible case for it. This became a big narrative after he beat Shai, but I think fumbling in big moments vs the Knicks shows he’s still not the top dawg at the highest level. So I don’t know about that
I mean how many of the Spurs fumbles were on him and not his teammates?
A couple of very high profile moments were on him. He lost them at least one game and probably two in the final minutes. With margins that razor thin, you have to think that if he was better in the clutch, they’d probably have a championship right now regardless of Fox and Johnson’s mistakes. Tbh it’s probably the best experience a young player could ask for, so a good chance he comes back next year and is just a cold and calculated killer
He missed some free throws and had a bad turnover in like the last 15 seconds of 2 losses. I think he’s the best player currently, nonetheless.
No, Wemby was not the best player. But keep believing whatever you want.
He just was always positive against any opponent lineup throughout the entire season end to end
Just like Jokic and Embiid in the 2019 to earlier 2020s, I’m not going to say they aren’t the best just because their backup goes -10 in 6 minutes a game
I mean SGA had the highest +/- this year if you just take that. SGA also had the highest advanced metrics of any player this year. Plus he won MVP this year and Wemby finished third.
Combining with the playoffs he was a consistent minus
SGA was a +39 in the play offs. He wasn’t good against the Spurs but by the same measure you can argue Wemby was a non-factor against us by +/-.
The rings argument was a made up narrative, which doesn’t even make sense since he’s never had the most anyway
If you ask a casual who has the most rings, a large chunk of people would say “Jordan”
Big Shot Rob erasure
NBA and Nike marketing money.
His defensive stats are also inflated. Look at how many of his “steals” are actual steals lol.
Same with lebron
Industry plant
Industry plant who had averaged 37 points and won a dpoy. Not too bad.
I don’t agree he was an industry plant, but dpoy is something the NBA industry votes on, so you’d just be proving his point
You’re probably joking, but sports is the one area where I don’t think it’s possible to be an industry plant, because there are hard numbers to prove someone’s worthiness.
my ears, man, fuck
wemby better
LeBron was being considered the GOAT before he had a ring too lol
This is just not true i understand LeBron greatness and what he done for the league but you don’t have to start lying now
The revisionist history is insane, this guy actually believes what he’s saying too
Complete insanity
He probably doesn’t even remember what happened in 2011 either
lol no
You have to be insanely young to not know this. He was getting GOAT talks when he was 16
https://youtu.be/iuNskCaOKvI
Just listen to how they talked about him in literal high school
Difference between “he could be” and 5 years in.
The Chosen One
I’m 44, I witnessed Lebrons whole rise. Greatest prospect of all time, sure. No one ever said he was the GOAT before winning a ring, and not seriously at all until 2016.
Then you didn’t do a very good job at paying attention. GOAT potential means you’re in GOAT talks.
lol Lebron fans are too damn funny. OK bud 👌🏼
Not a LeBron fan lol
Ok just dumb
I watched NBA since ‘89 until now. LeBron was getting massive hype and talks about potential to become the GOAT, but no one with more than double digit IQ ever called LeBron the GOAT when he was 16.
The discussion is being called the GOAT, not that he had potential to be one.
You think people were calling 16 year old Lebron the GOAT the same way Jordan is being called it here after winning a ring and DPOY?
No, but they started when he was in HS. He was getting literal comparisons to Wilt, Oscar, Kareem, Magic, Bird, MJ, Shaq, and Kobe in the game I linked. AT 16. You’re crazy if you don’t think that’s absolutely insane compared to the “glaze” of MJ in this video
Potential to be the GOAT = | = being called the GOAT
It’s not even the same discussion lol
It’s slightly different though, with MJ they’re saying play wise he’s clearly better than anyone before him, but with Lebron it’s always this idea of accolades and accomplishments when they say stuff like he could be the GOAT or “the chosen one” early on in his career.