We’re definitely going to be a better team this coming year, barring injury. That said, we might win fewer games because there’s not going to be six tanking teams this time around.

People are hurt by the Jaylen Brown trade. They see Jaylen Brown compared to Paul George and that’s it and say we’re worse. Not looking at it in totality.

This actually happens fairly often where people just consider the top end talent and don’t really think about the surrounding pieces or how they fit.

The Pistons had one 20+ PPG scorer and 5 guys who averaged 10+ and they won 60 games and were 1 game away from an ECF trip.

Last year Tatum (21.8), George (17.3), Pritchard (17.0), White (16.5), Queta (10.2) is similar offensive output, and they just shored up their biggest defensive weakness by adding Robinson. Not to mention if any of the other young guys break out and opportunities open up with guys like Simons/Vucevic being out of the equation.

The Celtics can still be really good in the regular season, but I do acknowledge when the playoffs roll around, players get schemed against and like the Pistons who lacked that reliable secondary scorer, defenses will crowd Tatum and someone else will need to step up, and I’m not sure we have that guy who can control a game the way Brown could, or other reliable vets in the past like Holiday and Horford could. The playoffs will be a real test if Gonzalez, Scheierman, Walsh or someone else is able to step up and supplement the team when they need it.

At the end of the day, I think we’ll need a true Brown replacement and so I think the idea is to ultimately flip Paul George, picks and other players who can get us that guy next summer, but this should still be a fun year right up until April, and then it’s sort of a “we’ll see” on where we really stand.

My concern is 3 key contributors in PG, Mitch and JT post-achilles being able to hold up for like 60+ games and a playoff run. JB has been pretty solidly available throughout his career outside of one postseason.

If everyone (especially PG) stays relatively healthy, it makes the trade look a bit better

Theres so much cope in this sub 😂

We lost a top 15 player in the league and replaced him with a past prime PG who we will be lucky if he stays healthy more than 50 games and playoffs. Tatum will be back more healthy so sure that will be good. Mitch Robinson is a good pickup for sure (not this super elite big yall are hyping up though). DWhite appeared to take a step back last year.

I think at best we Maintain the current standard, but at most we’re a 1st - 2nd round playoff team, at worst we’re in the play in.

People saying we’re “definitely going to be a better team than last year” are seeing what they want to see in my opinion, how we are “definitely better” remains to be seen.

The team will be better but my frustration is that we could have added Mitchell Robinson and had all those guys continue to develop while keeping JB and been even better than we are now.

Boston fans are overrating Robinson like crazy. He’s always hurt, he can’t play back to backs and he can’t play more than 20 minutes a game or else he will most definitely be hurt. The Knicks got a unicorn of a season and playoff run out of Mitch. Don’t expect that again.

Less rim pressure

Worse point of attack defense on opposing quick twitch wing stars (Shai, Brunson, Mitchell, etc)

Uncertain health/availability for MitchRob, Process P, & Tatum.

The rest of the East getting better.

Likely to end up in a mid to low playoff seed & face stiff 1st round competition. 

If this season’s Celtics match last years win total or offensive (2nd) & defensive (4th) league rankings I will eat my hat. 

Entirely possible they will get to the 2nd round tho! I happen to think the Philly loss was kinda flukey anyways (team wide 3pt shooting collapse, no center depth vs 3 games of surprise throwback Embiid vs very limited center rotation, some bad but fixable coaching/strategy)

This years team is no more likely to win a title certainly. 

Paul. George.

Has played in more than 55 games only once in the past 7 seasons. It’s not 2016 anymore homie.

Let us not forget Pritchard. He’s definitely not Brunson but he is going to be good and important for us.

Imo we are still a playoff team. But 76ers and Knicks, on paper, are better than us. I think the ceiling is EC Semifinals even if PG stays healthy

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I don’t think there are people actually saying last year’s team is better. Some people are pointing out that half the league was tanking last year, which inflated the win total of the teams that were trying to win. Given that no one will be tanking next year, most of the teams in the East also improved, and we have some important players with a history of injury concerns, it’s fair to expect that this team won’t match last year’s win total.

Because people are incredibly attached to JB, for good reason but are unable to entertain that maybe, just maybe his team play wasn’t as good as it looked

Why compare this team to the Game 7 team, rather than the Game 5 and 6 teams, which also lost to Philly?

Fair to wonder how we are better than the Game 5 and 6 team. 

You really don’t understand how fans think that losing Brown diminishes our talent?

The Mitchell addition was good, and if PG is load managed well, that’ll be a bonus but I honestly think the only way they will be better is if Tatum’s healthy and is motivated to really step it up to be a serious MVP caliber season

We’ll be better, but so will a bunch of teams

• Hawks on the rise
• Knicks defending champs
• Miami should be better than 9th seed
• Wizards huge question mark but undoubtedly better
• Pistons still good
• Cavs, especially if they add LeBron

I’m guessing 52-54 wins - strong but not top contender status, 3rd or 4th seed. Which, to be clear, is a pretty big win for the last year of resetting the cap

If you swapped Tatum in for Brown, period, I think you’re a better team for the games where we only had one of them.  

There’s several other improving teams in the East though, and we’re not playing the same field.  

So, looking at last year, I don’t think we’d finish worse with the current team, and there’s arguments to be made that we’ve shorn up a weakness as is.  

But this is a new year, with some heavy movement in the off-season.  Miami is better.  Philly is better. The Knicks won it all.  If we regress we do.  And if the model works to get back to 55+ wins as is, terricic

JB’s departure will have much more of an impact than the analytics support and it will take time to adjust. Was it a better play long term, begrudgingly yes. But to think we got immediately better is copium imo.

Yes they definitely lose if joe starts the same starting five and coaches the same way. They will always choke with this coach. Plus the sixers win in 5 against this Celtics team.

A fully healthy Tatum last year is a better team without brown.

The people who think they’ll be worse listen to too much sports media who are more pissed that we “lost the trade” and who don’t care we lost brown. Meanwhile those same sports media folks have been asking for them to be broken up for years and now like the dog who caught the car don’t know how to react.

Last year the Celtics lost in the first round, this year I expect the same. Whatever nuance you want to place

We added size with Robinson, which was the most glaring weakness against embiid, so I agree there is the potential to be better. Who knows if it works out that way because what things look like on paper don’t always play out, but I for one am intrigued to see how Tatum does as THE guy. Yes it’s always been his team, but he shared the load with JB (willingly I might add), so if he’s healthy it’ll be interesting to see if he finds a new level we didn’t know was there. Would I rather we still have JB? Of course, but this is the reality of the situation, so that’s what I’m hoping for

Sorta depends on how you measure “better”.

I think we have a better regular season team and could end up with more wins, but barring continued development of our youth (who could take huge strides) we aren’t as good as last year’s disappointing playoff team with both Tatum and Brown.

I’m less concerned with regular season wins than playoff success. I do have a ton of confidence in our development of the youth and with Mazzulla to continue to get the most out of everyone, so I wouldn’t be surprised if we had more playoff success this year - it’s just not currently there on paper as I see it.

On paper we are definitely a better team. But here’s the thing, Tatum is coming off an achilies injury. While he looked good in short stints, he clearly was not 100% and he was basically cooked after 5 playoff games. We may not be getting 70 games out of Tatum like we did Jaylen last year. If Tatum needs more load management than in the past or misses a big chunk of the season, this team could very much struggle to crack 50 wins in a conference that improved around us.

Nobody in the world is saying this is a worse team than the Tatum-less squad last year.

The problem is the rest of the East is much better.

i honestly love all this post JB cope, plese keep it coming

Because Joe Mazzulla is still coach

Ya it’s a lot worse. Pretty obviously. If you care about regular season record over ability to make a deep postseason run you’re a loser. In Boston we hang banners

Injuries are the only counter argument 

Mitch could miss time (very probable)

PG could miss games (probable)

Tatum could miss time (much less probable)

They are better if healthy but I still rate their championship chances below the team with JB. 

Wow Celtics fans are really coping this hard? The Jaylen Brown trade is one of the most lopsided moves in league history.

Roster by age

• Paul George: 36
• Mike Conley: 38
• Derrick White: 32
• Jayson Tatum: 28
• Payton Pritchard: 28
• Sam Hauser: 28
• Mitchell Robinson: 28
• Neemias Queta: 27
• Ron Harper Jr.: 26
• Baylor Scheierman: 25
• Jordan Walsh: 22
• Amari Williams: 24
• Chris Cenac Jr.: 19
• Hugo González: 20
• Luka Garza: 27

In a perfect world they should be better. But I could see someones opinion on it being worse.

This season is going to hinge on injuries and progression. Mitch and George are historically injury prone and there is the Tatum piece of it.

Also need Hugo or Pritch to elevate to the next level. (in a perfect world both would take a step)

An icing on all of that would be White getting back to shooting with respectable efficiency…. last year was painful to watch for him on offense.

i think it’s mostly the guys like me who value brown over tatum. we don’t see a tatum run team as a team that can compete. also they are going to shoot even more 3’s, and i don’t see it panning out(also will be boring as hell). like last season for instance i expected them to play about how they did because i knew brown was capable of making a lottery team great.

Last year we had Tatum and Brown. Next year we just have Tatum. It is not clear Tatum can really carry a team on his own. Also, I am bit worried about D. White.

People need to realize we had BOTH Tatum and Brown in the playoffs. We’ll probably be fine but talent wise we took a big downgrade. Our 2nd best player last season in the playoffs was JB. Now it might be Pritchard?

They lost 3 out of 6 with Tatum and Brown both on the floor and you think they are better without Brown because they signed the Knicks’ backup center?

no body is saying that

I think our team will be better, while the East will be much better. But our goal remains: To be ready to go all in next summer. Whatever we achieve this year is nice, but we’re still playing with house money.

Celtics will win the games where they shoot well from 3 and lose the games where they don’t shoot well from 3.

We had one guy that we could go to when they 3s weren’t dropping, and he is no longer on the team lol

Health would be the biggest concern. Win total could go down because there will be less tanking teams. I think the playoff ceiling is lower with this roster than a Tatum-brown roster, but this was a move made with 2028 made in mind

This years team will be worse.

While Tatum was out, we had excellent health. We will need to have excellent health this year to top last year, for the regular season anyway

Anyone who says they know probably said they knew we’d be a play in team last year. 

??!!!! We are not going to be a better team. The 3 main players are injury prone or coming off an injury.

I think regular season we are about the same level of team, maybe slightly improved. Basically take the squad that Brown led to all those wins without JT, swap Tatum for him, and add pieces to make the team better. But they are fragile pieces - even if PG somehow has new found health post-steroid treatment, Mitch is basically a guarantee to miss ~30 games. Bottom line, we still aren’t contending with this roster unless guys like Hugo and Baylor take massive leaps this season.

That said, we do have “optionality” around the trade deadline. Depends on what happens across the league but we have the ability to really improve our roster before the playoffs.

So the Celtics get to the second round? Maybe?

Also lots of other teams improved. 

If Paul George can stay healthy and play what he is capable of we should be ok

are they going to be true contenders? i don’t think so. they’ll be a good team, just like last year, but not true contenders and thats what youre excited about? like it’ll still be fine to watch the young guys grow and all that, but they’re no closer to a chip than they were last year. lateral move at best.

We def will make it further than round 1 imo

By this logic the Pacers should trade Siakam for Hauser because Haliburton + Hauser > Siakam, and they’re probably going to have a better season than last year.

It’s pointless to compare it to last season, the only comparison is next year with Paul George vs next year with Brown.

Hugo will be all NBA

Adding Robinson doesn’t solve the main issue we lost in the first round. Our offense was predictable, boring, and we didn’t add anyone that could solve that. We’ll be more scrappy yes, but our ceiling remains the same, a playoff team that’s not a serious contender.

PG is 110m for 2 yrs assuming he opts in. Might play 80 games. Celtics stuck with him for 2 yrs seems likely. Might pkay 100 games. 1.1m a game.

Why replace Brown with Tatum when they could just as easily have both as well as Robinson? Instead we get Paul George for 40 games. Unless he gets suspended again.

Got beat by a one legged Embiid who was out of shape. We’ll have a good team next season, but looks like we’re headed towards no man’s land. Too good to make the lottery, not good enough to compete for a championship. Plus we got ripped off with the draft capital. At least force Philly to toss in an extra two 2nd rounders.

Boston bench players bunch of bums haha

I do think that we may benefit from going to one, single, unifying locker room leader - like we benefited from jettisoning smart, to make room for the jays.. I can’t confidently say we’ve improved.

Because they aren’t??? You green teamers are something else

I feel like people aren’t seeing the upside in Queta either. This guy showed things it takes years to develop on this team last year. The idea of him and Tatum running the pick and roll next season like we saw w White last season has me excited

Sure…now imagine a 76ers team with Maxey (1 year closer to prime), VJ (now in 2nd year), highly motivated JB, and reasonably healthy Embiid. Last year’s conference is not this year’s conference. Like, even with teams improving/avoiding tanking, the defending champs’s core is still in tact. Oh and Bron is most likely back in the EC 🙃. It doesn’t matter if this team can get out of the first round. We are 1 year removed from Tatum’s injury, which means we’re back to assessing this team in regards to Finals/championships. As currently constructed, I am not confident that we’re better than the Knicks, Spurs, and Thunder. Brad could still make some moves, so it’s to TBD for me. We’re not going to suck but we’re not champion contenders. Also, if we don’t add, I think our next step is dependent on Tatum taking a MVP leap. I mean he needs to be competing with the likes of SGA, Jokic, and Wemby.

Better shots with Pritchard no ball hogging by Brown or his turnovers
More rebounds and blocks with Robinson , better 3 pt shots with George . Better bench matured Hugo and developing Harper

It won’t be better next season. We lost a MVP finalist and a top 15 player in the NBA, and a culture leader on the team. We’ll probably do about the same as last year.

Dear lord someone revisit this post in January

The east was a joke last year. Now a lot of teams are better and we probably won’t be the two seed if we’re being honest.

On top of that, Robinson and George have trouble staying healthy and will likely play 50ish games or less. Plus Tatum is still a guy who tore his Achilles a year ago so his durability isn’t the same, he’ll get more rest than brown did.

That’s why. The trade was a step back, the roster overall got worse. Compared to last year, hopefully we’re just as good but now the east has a lot of teams who will be significantly better than last season. Toronto, Washington, Miami, and Indiana. Combine that with the Knicks, Cavs, and Pistons who should all remain 50+ win teams.

“If” doing a lot of work

All the guys you cite + the guys we added have injury concerns

The guy that left was dependable

I haven’t seen anyone say that, we will be just as good if not better

I Think your gonna see the best version of Tatum. Especially now JB is gone.

Tatum/PG, if healthy, is way better than just JB. If they both play this team can win around 60 games. Just hinges on PG not being a glass man. I actually am in the minority where I think Tatum, if he can return close to his pre injury self, is a top mvp candidate based on performance on high usage rate. You can’t pair him with a guy like Jaylen who, rightfully so, thinks very highly of himself and can lead a team because it messes up the dynamic.

It’s because people think Jaylen is good when he’s actually not that good and they think Paul George is not very good when he’s still excellent. There’s a reason the two best GMs in the sport + 2 other really good GMs in Morey and Frank have all traded for him - his analytics are fucking excellent. Massively winning player. Payton Pritchard also can significantly increase his usage just fine. He was incredible this season with high usage. And Mitch and Conley are really good players too and the draft picks look promising and Hugo is an analytics darling who will get more minutes this season. We will be possession maxxing this season and putting up a ton of threes.

We’ve been the best team of all time for multiple seasons now *without* Jaylen. He has massively been dragging us down for years, people just don’t want to admit that. This is the last 4 *playoffs*. The off net rating would be the best net rating of all time for a regular season.

https://preview.redd.it/ny3ir53oxtdh1.png?width=1390&format=png&auto=webp&s=99e71842553e7c1ef38c792ea8ccf0357ea4c3ec

This data does not apply for Tatum. It’s +9.4 on -2.5 off and it’s +13.1 when Jaylen is off the floor and Tatum is on and -3.6 when it’s Jaylen on Tatum off.

You can also go look at analytics like RAPM and they are not in Jaylen’s favor. I’m probably going to get downvoted for this, but I’m right and it’s what Brad thinks.

Who are you counting on to score down the stretch? I feel like JT has to become a better version of himself for this to work.