Luka plays a “Player vs. Player” game
According to Luka
That’s about right
I’m not even mad at it. Although Bird and Magic have to be linked in my own, personal headcanon.
It’s kinda funny cuz magic was pretty much always ranked ahead of Bird until the last few years or so.
(Edit- if you think you disagree, seriously, look up pretty much any ranking pre-2020)
I don’t think that’s true. Bird used to be ranked ahead because of his defense (one of the best team defenders of his era, and made multiple all defense teams). Then as the years went by people remember Bird being slow and unathletic when he was older and say Magic is better because of defense lol, based only on appearance.
I can only tell you as I remember it but Larry Bird is my favorite player of all time and Magic was so routinely ranked ahead of bird that I had come to accept it. Beat Larry in college, twice in the nba finals, equal mvps but two more nba championships and an additional finals mvp. It just felt like the argument was settled. But now it feels like it has changed.
Magic had more good years and won more in the h2h but Birds peak years (probably 83-86ish?) were better than Magics peak imo.
I’m just saying go look up any all time ranking prior to 2020 and you will find Magic ahead of Bird and Bird pretty much never cracks top 5.
I agree with you on the peak argument.
Not so. “Rings erneh” really started after Jordan won his 6 so his fans could say he was GOAT.
lol. People were calling Jordan the goat after the first 3peat. Bird was literally calling Jordan the best before he even won one.
It was the 6 rings argument that they used to “cement” it. Bird could see he was already the best basketball player without Jordan having won a ring. After 6 rings, the discourse on individual greatness changed.
Wilt was seen by many as the GOAT having only won twice.
Jordan’s 6 being the standard for GOAT doesn’t necessarily make sense given Russell, but ultimately Jordan has many fans that argue his goatness. I wouldn’t necessarily disagree, I’m just saying that’s when ring culture started. Your points only support what I’m saying.
Before that people understood it’s a team game and winning championships is a team accomplishment. It’s used to buttress a case for someone, not be the end all. It’s started to shift since because LeBron only has 4 and many want to call him the GOAT. Plus what Durant did.
Bird had shooting, scoring, defense, rebounding over Magic Johnson, and with excellent playmaking in his own right. Most people at the time could see it.
Your anecdote doesn’t seem truthful at all. Why bring college into it? Larry Bird carrying INDIANA STATE to the championship game was monumental. Michigan State had 3 other future NBA players besides Magic Johnson and was much better overall than ISU.
I am basically ancient in this sub, and I grew up watching Larry Legend and Magic battle it out. The way that I remember it, Larry was viewed as being the better player, with a higher ceiling when they came into the league. In 1988 everyone outside of California had Bird ranked over Magic.
By 1996 most people’s top 5 had KAJ, MJ, Magic, and Bird plus either Wilt or Bill Russell.
In 2005 Magic was ranked higher than Bird, but they were still usually right beside each other at 4&5 or 5&6.
With the rise of Jokic more people are beginning to gain an appreciation for Bird’s game, and his all-time ranking has risen in response.
For me they are tied for 4th all time.
I think it’s moreso because Magic has a better argument for best PG in competition with steph than Bird does against Lebron for best SF
Not as I remember. This predates Steph and LeBron.
Prime Bird is always considered ahead of prime Magic. Overall career though goes to Magic.
Bird over Bron?
Jokic.
He picked bird over em both
lol in no world
MJ curry Bird LeBron wilt
I was joking but curry in top 5 is crazy
most definitely not. who else changed the game more? nobody who else was more talented? who else shot the ball better? who else won at his level? it’s easily curry if you’re not taking into account bullshit nostalgia.
Shaq, Kobe, Duncan, and Russell all better than Curry.
No. refer to my previous comment
So where is George Mikan. Dont see a player that impacted the game more than him
so how do their talent levels stack up? bye
Bye Felicia
Bird finished 2nd on MVP voting 3 straight years, then won MVP the next 3 straight years, then come in 3rd and finally 2nd. All NBA first team those same straight 8 years, finishing 2nd in All NBA defense 3 years straight, won 3 championships and 2 Finals MVP’s. 8 years of sheer dominance.
I think magic was top 3 voting in MVP for a decade straight, as a pass first player too which is crazy.
There’s a reason they call him the legend
Luka is taking Jokic over every black player (minus Jordan)
People take every black player over him for MVP, seems only fair. 🫣😅
Bro has 3 MVPs btw
Talking about Doncic not Jokic :) it was an obvious joke also.
The black players y’all demonize because they’re in MVP conversations?
Yeah no idea why he thinks this is a gotcha. Every player that’s threatened Jokics status (Shai, Embiid, Giannis) has been slandered into oblivion. Wembys got a season before we’re seeing r/nba hit pieces on him too for lapping their goat.
What is the most suspect discourse amongst the four you mentioned? They all have pretty clear reasons why they’re disliked, whether you agree or not.
You all are acting like Ant isn’t this sub’s and media’s fan favorite. Or like it didn’t take Jokic 2 years of elite big man play to even start getting into conversations. No need to force this discourse man
Why do Shai and Embiid get flack? For flopping? Good thing Jokic never does that right? Why does Giannis get flack on this subreddit? For Kalshi and streaming affiliations? Good thing Jokic doesn’t do gambling ads and have personal connections to the Serbian dictator right? Everything I’ve linked is from Reddit, so you can’t even say it’s obscure for the subreddit to know. Everything people hate on them for Jokic does as well. Wonder what’s the difference between him and the rest?
Also you’re burying the lede with the Ant mention. The reason his reputation is good is because he isn’t a legitimate MVP contender threatening Jokic legacy like Shai, Embiid, or Giannis. I assure you the moment he finishes top 2 in MVP voting they’ll turn on him too, just like your Slovenian buddy two comments up.
Why are you implying that Jokic doesnt get flack for flopping lol, for the past 2 years thats the thing mentioned the most
Giannis has not been slandered into oblivion not even close And shai’s slander started with the mavs series in 2024 he was already pretty hated by the time the mvp race heated up
Flair checks out
International fans will always pick Jordan it seems
So will most american fans
For a 2v2 absolutely lol.
Most? I know Bulls fans will definitely say him and probably most older fans too, but I feel like I see a lot of younger fans say LeBron is the goat. Maybe that’s just social media though
Younger fans grew up watching Bron so it kinda makes sense. They probably don’t bother with a comprehensive and nuanced comparison either. Similarly one or two generations in the future young people at that time will probably rank superstars they grow up watching over Bron
I have no qualms with this ranking.
Luka knows ball
Don’t hate it honestly
Seems about right
Sounds good to me
This is correct…I have no problems with this
The ranking is clearly “players who were in Space Jam” > Jokic > everyone else.
I’m presuming LeBron gets a penalty for the horrible sequel
A LeBron hate thread, classic
No complaints here
No notes
Alright, grandma.
If he had said Bird over MJ we might have gotten an answer behind the Lakers’ offseason strategy
He did put jokic and bird over lebron which is equally wild
He was probably thinking current version until the guy switched to retired players
Shaq and Magic were named before LeBron though.
You think Magic and Shaq can play more than a quarter of NBA basketball today?
it was a who would he pick to play alongside him in a 2v2 not rankings i think
Its really not THAT wild. Larry probably had the highest peak of any player in history imo. If you are not talking about longevity at all you have to put Larry that high.
I would’ve had a hard time putting anyone past 2012-2018 LeBron.
Process of elimination means that Luka thinks Jordan is the GOAT, debates settled.
in 2v2
Feel like Jokic is a terrible pick for 2v2 compared to 5v5 though
Yeah I feel like his brain turned into 1v1 like “say the better player” but even in 2v2 Luka wants a big to throw to, and likes jokic’s all around abilities.
Shaq would’ve been the pick for 2v2 with Luka
Maybe he wants to keep the paint open with jokic being an actual threat from three would mean they couldn’t really help on either.
I think there’s a “who would I have the most fun with” bias as well
And shaq is undoubtedly the goat in a 2v2
u aint see me play
Where’s da video
Prime hakeem over shaq maybe
what about hypothetical shaq stays in shape versus prime hakeem?
I mean might as well say hypothetical Hakeem end of career brain with beginning of career athleticism. What about Thanos with all the infinity stones?
it’s already a hypothetical, it’s not a slippery slope.
I take Loki as the multiverse
Still Hakeem obviously
I think prime hakeem defensively could give shaq trouble. He’s the only big I might take over prime shaq.
shaq was very much in-shape in orlando
I’m taking the Shaq & KD over Hakeem and whoever else (and even Hakeem & KD) imo.
Not if you’re playing 1s & 2s (which is as common as it is stupid).
Naw. You know when he plays it’s as selfless compared to any other player. Plus his 2man game with Murray is pretty on point.
I think this 2v2 is a scenario of him and whoever he’s naming. Luka Jokic 2 man would be the best 2man in this league for how dominant Jokic is inside and how much Luka can create a shot or dominate inside and out
Um, I think a MJ-Shaq team would kill Luka-Jokic.
Well yah, but in the context of the video it seems its Luka+whoever he names. But he picks Bird Jordan aside from Jokic, cause those are the most greatest scorers of all time that can probably be good with him. I wonder why he didn’t choose Shaq tho, but Jokic also makes sense.
I wouldn’t say terrible. He may not pass you to death but he would score more in the low post with more space.
I feel like 2v2 I’d want a hyper-athletic dude rather than Jokic in Luka’s shoes. Then again, he’s a much better basketball player than I am. 😂
I mean 2v2 you need him to do a lot, in a 5v5 I think he could get away with a more one dimensional lob threat. But yeah, wtf do I know lol
I feel like there are a lot of subpar duos that could blow by a Luka/Jokic pairing. Then again, they can shoot. 🤷
He also thinks Jokic and Larry Bird are better than LeBron…
No, he thinks they’d be better complements to him in a 2 on 2 game.
There was no mention of Paul George though
LUKA TO DENVER
Everyone’s been saying it. Make Mile High Luka real.
I just need to see him happy that’s all
He looks pretty happy here tbf
Why would anyone trade Luka in his prime? You would have to so stupid…
Because defense wins championships and fortune favors the bold
Milk High City
I can’t imagine them being as successful together i.e runs to the finals.
Having to share the playmaking (similar to Lebron/Luka) with the salaries also, I believe one would diminish them individually and team-wise. Purely hypothetical of course but it would take an unreal GM to build around them both and the star power of them would have them pinned to win it all regardless of who is with them.
As a Dallas native living in Denver who abandoned the Mavs to follow Luka, this is my dream scenario.
Jokic to Lakers
They have been assembling the all-white team
Jokic would not want to deal with LA media and celebrity status
He’s already angsty asf rn why would he sign to LA for more traffic and less horses
I mean Ballmer could just build him the worlds biggest horse ranch surrounded by Kawhis trees to keep it private
So not the Lakers but the Clippers
Nah
I pray that Luka becomes a free agent in 2028 so he could play with Jokic. All buckets no defense.
I like how people ignore that it’s way more likely that Jokic ends up in LA, than Luka joining a small media market like Denver. LA has a long history of stealing superstar big men from small market teams, but this sub hates the Lakers, so I’m not surprised lol
Under normal circumstances you’d be right, but Jokic is not leaving Denver so if Luka wants to play with him he’s gotta head our way.
(she says, while Jokic refuses to sign his extension just yet 👀)
Jokic gets paid more if he waits until next year to sign. Also the privacy he’s afforded living in a small market city would appeal more to Luka but Luka’s management team would hate it.
Remember when Giannis was never going to leave Milwaukee?
Not even close to the same… Luka would be a closer comparison because he had no say there. But Giannis is different because of media games and pressuring the FO constantly
There’s less than zero chance Jokic would go to LA.
Lebron after watching this: tell Rob I’m out
No wonder Lebron left 😭
Rob aint even thinking about 41 year old Lebron at all
So this is why LeBron left
LeBron just doesn’t have the same class that Luka and Jokic have
Yeah those 2 just play the game the right way. Real first guy in the gym, scrappy guys
Bring your lunch bucket and horse feed to work type guys
Does LeBron even own a lunchpail?
It’s 2 on 2 right? So teaming with him? LeBron’s skill set is duplicative. At least Jokic has size.
If it’s teaming with him in 2v2 Giannis or Shaq seem like the best bets. Size, rim protection + lob threat for him. I don’t think that’s really how he was answering.
Orlando Shaq yes. 2v2 is a mobile game, fat Shaq won’t last long if he keeps getting pulled out to 3pt line to defend.
Jokic is better floor spacer than Giannis or Shaq. That’s why Bird outranked him. Jordan’s offensive game is OP.
You don’t need floor spacing in a 2v2
you do if you wanna drive and not get collapsed
Same argument could be made about Bird but he took Bird
Bird is better shooter than Bron I think and better than Jokic of course
Jokic is just center Luka. Him and Shaq would be unstoppable
Why does it seem like Jokic is watching him lol?
If youre playing 2v2 and dont take Shaq you dont wanna win.
Luka for Jamal Murray + whatever picks they want
These comments always crack me up.
we have no picks guys. We have zero tradable first round picks at all, and three total second round picks until 2030. The Nuggets literally dont have any good picks to trade lol, that’s why all our inclusion in trade rumors is just silly
It’s Jokic for Reaves then
Jokic for Kessler+
2 euro superstars teaming up in the biggest media market for the #1 global brand in basketball, or them doing it in Denver? I wonder which is more likely 🤔
if you put it like that, welcome home luka to CO
Denver
Jokic would hate being in the biggest media market
I’m glad my dude has appreciation for Bird’s greatness.
I hate the Celtics but Bird was incredible. His game really would’ve translated to any new era.
He gets lots of hate these days so I’m glad to see it too tbh
Bird gets hate?? In fact he might be the most loved player when you look at the demographic of this sub
Stat heads have turned on Bird hard they tryna get him up outta here 🤷🏾♂️
I don’t buy this at all, I’m a Lakers and Bird is one of my favorite player of all time.
he didn’t even hesitate picking Jokic over Lebron
Balkan boys unite (Ik Slovenia is more Slavic but lowe it)
Nor should be have
See you in Denver, my boy!
Haha more like see Jokic on the lakers
Jokic over Shaq, Magic or LeBron? 😂😂
In a 2v2 with Luka? Yeah probably.
Dump it into Shaq and win 😂
In this imaginary world there’s an opposing 2v2 and they’re: ~15% less dominating at offense and 80% better at ball handling and defense.
Nice stats you made up lol
Right as opposed to the clearly imaginary situation I’m suddenly Luka and you’re Shaq
Amusingly the “left out” pair of Shaq and LeBron would absolutely smoke any of those duos he chose.
EASILY BRO.
Luka trying to prevent a war in the Balkans
Unironically kinda, I think. Dude’s clearly having fun and committing to the bit.
Ball knower
Why did they stop before getting to Steph
This ‘game’ is so goofy
This is tampering and im here for it.
That settles it all they need to do is get Prime Jordan on their team and Luka will be just fine.
there it is; actual top 3
Luka 🤝 me
Abidas or Peepi
Certified ball knower Luka Doncic
Wow he picked Larry Bird over Joker.
fortinait o la babagi
I’ll take Shaq. But also Jokic over Bird would be my guess
Magic and LeBron would figure him out real quick, so would Kobe. Hakeem would destroy him
Jokic ain’t stopping Shaq
Shaq ain’t stopping Jokic
Yall are too young and glazing too hard.
Shaq was unstoppable
Jokic will just step out and lob 3s over his head. That’s literally what Kenny or Chuck said to shaqs face and he had no answer. And last time I checked 3 > 2
He likes Jokic so much because he doesn’t like to play defense, like himself.
Jokic over everyone including LeBron except Bird is a little suspicious and also crazy glaze. At least he picked Jordan at the end
He picked Jokic over Bron, take that LeBron
I agree bird of top 3. MJ Curry then Bird. Then you could say LeBron or wilt
I mean, are we not gonna address the elephant in the room or..?
Your victim complex?