Durag_and_Shades

73 | 12 hours ago

And like 2 months later Ron joins the Lakers to help win #16

JShuttlesworth28 | Vancouver Grizzlies

16 | 12 hours ago

Apparently he was already talking to the Lakers back in 08. After they had loss the finals Artest was in the Lakers locker room talking with Odom about the joining the Lakers.

OperationAdorable370

2 | 3 hours ago

If I remember correctly the story is that he actually went to the shower to talk to kobe after the lakers lost.

RyouBestGirl | Spurs

4 | 12 hours ago

KD before KD

jmchamakito | Puerto Rico

22 | 12 hours ago

Ray Allen joined Miami after being up 3-2 on them and losing. People don’t say shit about him because he was 36 and Boston had tried to trade him before.

Igoudala did it too. He was with Denver when Curry and the Warriors cooked them, so he joined them the next season too. Saw the potential.

A lot of players have done what KD did, but they weren’t as great as him, so they don’t get the same hate.

Skyfall24K

3 | 12 hours ago

Sorry but not fair comparisons. It’s one thing if a player is old and washed then trying to ring chase (like Ray Allen and Iggy). But when KD is in his absolute prime and decided to switch teams that’s a different story

jmchamakito | Puerto Rico

13 | 12 hours ago

Iggy was 29 when he joined the Warriors, and the year prior was an All Star with Philly. So he ain’t the same as Ray Allen.

Ray Allen also lost 2 years straight to Miami before joining them. He was older, but it still looked bad when he did it.

refreshing_yogurt

9 | 11 hours ago

I think that agrees with their point though. The better the player is, the worse the move looks and feels.

Main_Gain_7480 | Lakers

24 | 12 hours ago

Miss Jvg calling games

Tech_Quest8

9 | 12 hours ago

No one wants to admit it but Houston beats that team if healthy. Yao and Tmac weren’t playing and that series went to 7. Aaron Brooks made a name for himself.

Imagine a lineup of:

Brooks - McGrady - Artest - Scola - Yao and bench Lowry/Battier/Landry

UltramegaCornell

10 | 10 hours ago

It makes sense, but it also makes sense to assume the Rockets had to play damn near perfect basketball to push that Lakers team to seven games.

What I mean is that maybe having Yao and T-Mac in the lineup doesn’t automatically make the team better in that specific series. Maybe the role players don’t step up the same way because they’re relying more on the stars.
It changes the entire dynamic.

It’s like the Rockets vs. Warriors in 2018. Would Golden State have lost if CP3 stayed healthy? Maybe, maybe not. That’s the thing with these hypotheticals. Once you change a major piece, you change everything.

bumpedherhead

6 | 10 hours ago

Tmac is a serial choker and one of the most overrated players ever. He would have been a net negative. Yao would have definitely helped the Rockets though

Pimpcane-Shotgun | Lakers

3 | 6 hours ago

If

ChrisRhodes789

2 | 11 hours ago

Scola killed us that series..

whatssenguntoagoblin | Alperen Sengun

1 | 17 minutes ago

Idk about that. McGrady has literally never won a series ever. To claim he’s win this one is a massive stretch.

kr1saw | Lakers

1 | 10 hours ago

The Lakers had a issue guarding Brooks. Who wasn’t gonna get the same shots if tmac and Yao was as healthy.

Stop it.

Hopeful_Tea2139 | Lakers

-2 | 9 hours ago

Just like Lebron’s argument as the GOAT, all hypothetical scenarios.

Baseless, never going to happen, all imagination, just for the excuses.

Sammy2729 | Lakers

1 | 8 hours ago

Yes, his 2016 finals 3-1 comeback and 50000 points (his basis for the goat arguement) are all fake and we are imagining it

rocket_beer | Celtics

-5 | 7 hours ago

His 2011 “effort” disqualifies him, and forever holds him at 1b

Put it this way: when you lose 6 finals, you aren’t THE GOAT

When one of your peers has a 3-1 ring advantage over you, you aren’t THE GOAT

When your first ring came only after switching teams to someone else’s team, you aren’t THE GOAT

Chudson94 | Lakers

4 | 7 hours ago

Ok so does Jordan’s 6 consecutive playoffs not making the finals count him out?

The fact he had no success until Pippen arrived?

Or the fact that the team only lost two more games when he retired?

rocket_beer | Celtics

-2 | 6 hours ago

Jordan is 6-0 in the Finals.

He got to his peak and then dominated the entire time.

That is why LeBron losing 6 times in the Finals holds him at 1b.

LeBron also lost in the Olympics.

Curry has a 3-1 Finals record over LeBron.

When Jordan got to his peak, no one won against him.

Marioman775 | Cavaliers

1 | 5 hours ago

This is such a bad faith argument. 2011 is really the only blemish on LeBrons career which is really a bad one, however the fact he was able to drag some teams to the finals shouldn’t be held against him when Durant going to the Warriors gave LeBron 2 more finals losses on its own. Are we going to pretend that LeBron losing in the conference finals to improve his finals record makes his legacy better?

rocket_beer | Celtics

-2 | 4 hours ago

Only?? lol

LeBron has been on 2 of the most-lopsided finals losses in NBA history!

Not only that, he lost in the Olympics

It’s impossible to have a goat conversation with someone who either doesn’t know these simple facts, or ignores them.

Of course these matter! When it comes to the goat conversation, these are the utmost important factors that add up.

LeBron literally had to switch teams, and jump onto Wade’s team, with another perennial All-Star to win. It wasn’t organic in any way that it happened. It had to be orchestrated.

And even after constructing it, his finals losses started piling up.

Think about that sentence: LeBron’s finals losses started piling up.

Yes, that is why he is 1b. Period.

Marioman775 | Cavaliers

1 | 4 hours ago

Personally idc about the Olympics when it comes to the goat conversation. I don’t care much either for if you have LeBron or MJ as the goat. Your previous comments just seemed to trash him for the finals record when MJ had his own struggles but you had to shrink it to only the 6-0 record that mattered as his “peak”. LeBron has his struggles too but he’s carried a lot of bad teams further than they have any right to go, gets more criticism than anyone in history, so he tries to get a championship roster with other stars and gets hated on for that too. MJ had great roster construction his whole career once they started winning, he never needed to leave

rocket_beer | Celtics

-1 | 4 hours ago

That’s not “my personal assessment”.

This is canon.

Go to any forum, any tv pundit, any beat writer, any player, anyone…

Go ahead. Find someone who doesn’t think that was not MJ’s prime. Go on

Ohhhhh, you can’t? It’s just you?

Well then, I guess your own parameters are the problem here.

Jordan is 1A.

It must be taken from him if he were to ever drop down to 1b.

Given the actual results that I’ve listed, Jordan stands at 1A. LeBron is 1b.

Sammy2729 | Lakers

1 | 7 hours ago

2011 is a stain on his career, only one at that

Losing 6 finals is insane way to discredit because you’d rather him lose in the 2nd round then in the finals.

His peer who won zero fmvp’s over him?

rocket_beer | Celtics

2 | 6 hours ago

2011 is a stain on his career

Also, losing 6 finals holds him at 1b

Meaning: 1A is reserved for the guy who won 6-0 in the finals. And was always the Finals MVP.

Jordan only won gold in the Olympics.

You just cannot exclude these highest of priority parts that separate 1A from 1b.

Sweetest_Noise

4 | 8 hours ago

This was such a great series. Houston showed heart to take it to 7 games, even after Yao went down.

Yellow_Evan | Lakers

1 | 7 hours ago

I remember Derek Fisher was unplayable this series yet he played and started anyway.

delta-red-14

-11 | 12 hours ago

The shot silenced Artest like an out of court settlement silenced a Colorado hotel worker

Creepy_Action_8755 | Lakers

0 | 12 hours ago

Artest wanted him to stop but Kobe doesn’t take no for an answer

markmaybach

0 | 12 hours ago

Mamba Mentality!

Debits_equals_credit

-14 | 12 hours ago

The lakers win a ring if they win the series? Didn’t know that thanks for clarifying

ScaredOfWindow | Bucks

8 | 12 hours ago

This was the western conference semifinals. Winning this series did not guarantee that they would win a ring. The way OP phrased it was completely fine.

2009 Western Conference Semi-Finals. Series tied 1-1 going into a pivotal game 3. Ron Artest is trying to get into Kobe’s head. Kobe hits a ridiculous shot at the end of the 3rd quarter to silence Artest. Lakers win the series in 7 and end up winning a ring