Steven Adams Says Today’s Bigs Are Not Good At “Trench Work” Like Boxing Out
Shout out Gortat and Nenê
You know you made it when there’s a move or play named after you. The Gortat screen.
And remember when Nene was Hilario Nene?
The Polish Hammer
The Krakow Krusher
One of the best illegal screen setters. Man I miss him
His name was Nene Hilario
Full Story, his name is actually Maybyner Rodney Hilario (nicknamed Nenê), he later changed it legally to Nenê.
marcin was genuinely an underrated player.
Hmm I think he’s just not remembered by the youths rather than underrated. Even back in 2009 he was consistently referred to as “a starting level center who is very talented but doesn’t start because he backs up Dwight Howard.”
Remembered by the hwat?
Eh. More like, he’s a great name to bring up when you’re shooting the shit talking ball to guys. There’s good convo there
The Wall Gortat PnR was unguardable for a couple years.
Gortat screen is still used to this day. KAT just won a championship doing it!
Our starting 5 of John Wall, Bradley Beal, Otto Porter, Nene, Gortat worked so beautifully back in the day. John Wall facilitating all of those players playing their roles was so fascinating. I believe in 2016 (Markief Morris replacing Nene) was statistically the most effective starting lineup, even better than the Warriors. Too bad our bench sucked ass and would get outscored every game.
Wow this is nostalgic. Otto porter never missed a shot for like 6 years in a row.
Guessing Steve was thinking about this game lol
Nene had that old man strength when he was here. Was always excited to watch him play.
Perfect examples of the average “big man” archetype. The is what position-less basketball robbed from us lol
I remember for awhile if you looked at NBA salaries by country Poland made the most money per player on average because Gortat was the only Polish player in the league and was making like $8mil.
My fondest memories as a wizards fan …
always thought “trench work” soundded way more intense than boxing out idk
Polish Hammer 🔨 Love it!
Incredibly rare to have not one, but TWO Wizards called out as examples of doing something well. This might be a first. I’ll take it! 😂
Happy for him!
Such a humble, genuine, down to earth aquatic superhero.
He’s my favorite intergalactic bounty hunter for sure
Best ever Dothraki NBA player
Khal Lobo?
Couldn’t ask for a better dude to represent us, his sister is a crazy athlete too, a whole fucking family of giants.
Atlanteans?
even better, tongans
He fucked a fish
If I was a fish I would let Steven Adams fuck me as well
Let him suck the roe outta me
…..unless you look at who he likes on twitter.
Bro lowkey has a really relaxing voice damn
his kids gonna grow up to be as tall as Wemby with all the good sleep they get if Adams reads them bedtime stories
The genetics in his family are unreal. His sister won the Silver medal at shot putting in the 2016 Olympics.
Edit: and tons of other Olympic accomplishments
lmao this is the oddest summary of her career. she’s a four time medallist in shot put, including 2 gold (2008, 2012) and a bronze (2020)
Damn google AI. It’s been a minute so I did a 4 second lookup. Thanks for the correction.
Smh
And Steven and Valerie are two of the thirteen kids in their family. Imagine meeting a family of Maori warriors like this one centuries ago. That’s a no for me mate
To be precise, Steven Funaki Paea He Ofa Ki Loa Adams is Tongan/English, not Māori. But your point stands lol
Thanks for the correction. I just assumed because he was from New Zealand
Correct but you missed a few lol, Dame Valerie Adams has won 2 golds one silver and one bronze between 2008 and 2020
Dude should get into narrating ebooks or general voice acting as an exit plan
The kiwi accent is also nice
Chet catching strays
Ironically Wemby falls into this catergory of stretch centers who can’t rebound
Uber tall guy are rarely generation rebounders if ever, center of gravity is a bitch.
Most rebounding records post 60’s go to guys like Moses Malone, Barkley, Howard, even young Kevin Love. Those dudes were all 6’5-6’10 and no taller.
Edit: cant believe I forgot to mention Rodman
Andre Drummond and Deandre Jordan are 6’11” and were also some of the best rebounders for a good stretch. Not to nitpick or belabor your point though (as you did say most), as those guys are built like tanks and have outlier wingspan. I can’t think of anyone over 7’1 ish apart from Shaq, Kareem and Wilt that were elite rebounders.
Andre and DeAndre are thicc af. So their CoG is low enough
Yeah exactly
I still can’t believe that Drummond openly admited to missing some shots on purpose to get a rebound. Bro loved statpadding rebounds.
Moses Malone also said he would miss shots on purpose the grab the rebound in a better position to score
In Memphis we call those zbounds as Zbo was such a fan of that strategy
Bill Walton is another 7’1 guy who was a great rebounder.
He’s listed at 6’11”
He actually admitted that he’s taller than that and he downplayed his height so he wouldn’t be boxed to a typical 7 footer mold. If you looked at him during his playing days, he actually does look taller than 6’11.
I assure you he is not 7’1”. Google any picture with him and kareem and you will see he is at least 2 inches shorter.
Hakeem Ojaluwon was pretty good, but I guess he’s right on that edge depending on what measurement is being used.
11 rebounds in the golden era of post big men is certainly very good. All while being a defensive presence even out to the perimeter covering lots of ground .
His career numbers slanted by his latter years when not as healthy, rebouns roughly cut in half overall in his last 6 or so years
huh? most of them were…mutombo, drob, gilmore, gobert, eaton, etc. I think the limiting factor for these guys was minutes…staying healthy and playing big minutes. some of the uber tall guys played less than 30mpg.
the bigs today that suck at rebounding are mostly not even 7 footers. the 7 footers that are poor rebounders are the ones that sit on the 3pt line and don’t do much else like porzingis, turner, lopez, etc
I can’t think of anyone over 7’1 ish apart from Shaq, Kareem and Wilt that were elite rebounders.
O’Neal and Chamberlain were not over 7’1”.
Dikembe Mutombo and Artis Gilmore were both listed at 7’2” and led leagues in rebounding multiple times each. David Robinson was 7’1” and led the league once. Gobert is 7’1” and has been an elite rebounder for a decade straight. Robert Parish was listed at 7’1” 230 and was borderline elite for a decade – maybe even better, considering he had to share a lot of boards with McHale and Bird.
Kevin Willis was 7’0” and listed at 220, and was elite for several seasons, including one at 15.5 per game where he was bested only by Rodman.
Modern example could be Josh Hart. Averaged 10 rebounds/game in the finals at 6’5”
I popped in my NBA2K25 last night to play with the Knicks, and Josh Hart was listed as the PF. I’m like what the hell…..ok, I get it. Go get’em tiger.
You forgot the GOAT Reggie Evans.
Ben Wallace!!
Yeah when look look at the plus 7-footers like Ming, Bradley, Wemby, Chet, their rebounding numbers dont jump off the page. There’s that sweet spot between 6’8 and 7 foot where you get these guys who can really move and get up for the boards with great instinct.
Yea fair enough
I’m gonna need you to sit down and think long and hard about why you added Kevin Love to that list before your edit adding Rodman
He was on my mind because he was listed as 6’10 when hes 6’7 at best.
Also had a 30 pt 30 rebound game. He was a beast on the boards in Minnesota
EDIT: he was also so good at rebounding they did a sports science episode on him.
That Mitchell Robinson offensive rebound to put the series away was ridiculous. Wemby had position and was staring right at Mitch, but Mitch just walked him down under the rim with ease and put him out of position. Wemby’s gotta get his weight up. He can take advantage of similarly built guys like Chet who have zero ability to move him around, but thicker 7-footers are able to move him at will.
Wemby can make up for that with some length, so he’s still capable of being a board machine sometimes even if he’s moved out of position, but it clearly tires him out.
It’s a difficult balance though, put on weight and he loses mobility and increases his risks of injury.
What he needs is to improve his technique. Get his base wider, his CG lower. It would improve his screening too. He should model his game after Kareem Abdul Jabbar, who was quite skinny too.
He’d do well to model his rebounding off Kevin Garnett. He was always skinny and weighed a lot less than many centers but knew about positioning and boxing out as well as anyone.
They just need to get a guy they trust to play center in certain minutes, and then play Wemby in the 5 against smaller lineups
their game are similar in a lot of ways, Wemby’s jumper even looks quite a bit like KG’s
but kg was super wirey strong for being so skinny, and ended with some tree trunk legs and a crazy strong base, wemby might not ever be able to do that being so much taller, but yeah, that is probably the strongest skinny guy he can try to model his game after
KAJ also mostly played in an era where basically any contact was a foul, offensive, or defensive. It’s hard to try and model your game after a guy like that. When he didn’t have to deal with the MMA contest, being a big man has become with all the grappling under the basket. It’s part of the reason the great centers back then all had great footwork and signature moves. You couldn’t just muscle your way to the rim like Shaq. Even Shaq had great post moves, but by the 2000s, you no longer needed it and could just body guys out of the way.
What the Spurs really need is an actual power forward, someone like Randle(who is a very realistic target) who can bang down low and be that physical post presence, while also not necessarily clogging the lane for Wemby, Castle, and Harper(Fox would be going out in any hypothetical Randle trade). Also, it is supposed to be a foul, but refs don’t call it very often, but you aren’t supposed to have your feet much wider than your shoulders to set a legal screen. Gobert(another “slight” center) is pretty egregious with how wide he set’s up, and is called for it regularly, too.
That’s what im saying. They need a box out threat. Spurs are basically playing 4 guards with Wemby
put on weight and he loses mobility and increases his risks of injury.
What’s the actual evidence for that though?
Increasing muscle mass does not inherently reduce mobility and it will certainly increase his explosive movement ability. More weight may or may not increase the strain on his joints but muscle mass also helps stabilise the joints and resist hyperextension.
The main issue at his size would be actually putting on muscle without excessive bulking.
I guess it’s anecdotal. All the powerful big guys had bad injuries especially feet injuries when they put on weight. Yao Ming esp with over training and over playing. Embiid, Ben Simmons, greg Oden, Zion etc. I think Wemby is at high risk of this also especially if he plans to play deep into the post season every year.
As I said, a double edged sword. He’s had a DVT before as well. And any gradual hypertrophy will take years if it’s done right, so may not see immediate gains. I think the safest bet for him will be mobility exercises and injury prevention regimes, combined with complete whole body strength - so instead of aiming to bulk, aim to get strong eg with dead lifts, squats, big 4 exercises.
I dunno I’m sure he has a team taking care of his body. Hahah.
Putting on muscle in an intelligent way helps prevent injury. If you’re just trying to “get big” , then you’re not gonna focus on proper form/negatives/tendon strength and elasticity and will get hurt more easily
Exactly. Wemby has terrible fundamentals. He doesn’t really box out instead trying to use his arms and reach over his opponent which rarely works. He’ll learn but he could use his freakish size for so much more offensively than just hanging out on the perimeter and launching threes. And he needs to stop bringing the ball up court. He thinks he’s a guard and has handles like Jokic but he clearly doesn’t. Rant over.
I don’t think it was a weight thing (or at least that wasn’t the main reason). Dude was just utterly exhausted. He went from playing like 30 minutes a game to closer to 40, and was already pretty spent from the OKC series. I think if he can figure out conditioning and or the spurs can figure out how to manage his off minutes better, he’ll be fine
He should be doing rebounding drills with Kornet. That guy can bang (thanks Charles).
Putting on some weight isn’t going to matter when all of his opponents have a lower center of gravity.
Losing offensive rebounds to mitchell robinson is fine, he’s an elite offensive rebounder he’s gonna get a few
What was a bigger problem for wemby was getting boxed out by Jose Alvarado. Dude needs to work on his core strength
Porzingis had the same problem when he was in dallas, he would get boxed out by kyle lowry and guys his size. Then he worked on his core strength in the offseason and fixed it
The amount of times in the finals when the ball would come off the rim at Wemby, and he would be totally flabbergasted and not react in time was so frustrating.
The fact that a rebound is catching a 7’4 guy by surprise so often is crazy. It feels like he rarely looks for them, they just happen to find him if they are gentle enough.
There’s no way Wemby should be getting less than 10 rebounds a game. He should be grabbing 15 a game on bad days.
He averaged 11 but yes it should be more
A lot of this also has to do with the players offensive capabilities. A lot of times coaches tell these guys to run up for the fast break instead of getting the rebound. This duty falls on the other guys on the team
Jacking up more threes leads to longer rebounds on misses as well. Less rebounds when there’s less misses in the paint.
Yeah, it seems like there’s usually at least 4-5 times per game where Wemby and another teammate are the only ones in rebounding position and he just lets them grab it and starts running up court.
Also he was only playing like 30 minutes a game. That impacts counting stats
Spurs need a PF to rebound, Wemby already have alot to do on both offense and defense, he don’t need to do more. (This is already a major problem on defense where he often has to decide between contesting or securing the rebound, he can’t do both at the same time).
Yeah, the biggest player that Wemby played next to was Champagnie which puts a lot of extra pressure on him at both ends of the floor.
Why? Any 7 footer is tall enough to grab the ball off the rim with little to no jump. The hard part is getting into position to grab it which has just as much to do with strength and leverage. If Steven Adams hip checks him he’s getting moved every time.
Doesn’t matter how tall you are if you are getting pushed around. There’s a reason Westbrook was able to get 10 rebounds a game even if 5 of those are give me rebounds to push the pace (I don’t know the actual number, I’m just throwing a random one) half of it is because of his motor to just run around in positions and jump. These stretch 5 doesn’t have that kind of luxury. The moment the ball leaves someone’s hand they are going to be pushed out of position. Shit even before that since you don’t want them to even sniff the paint because of their wingspan, they’d get pushed. Even if they can throw their weight around I also really doubt coaches wants them to wrestle for the positions every possession. That shit is taxing.
I think he just chooses to have better defense than grabbing the offensive rebounds.
It’s hard to get offensive rebounds when you stand on the 3pt line waiting for someone to pass you the ball.
There was a free throw at the end of game 6 where Wemby tried to box out by turning his back to the rim and pushing the Knicks’ player with his forearms. Unsurprisingly, this resulted a different Knicks’ player getting the rebound.
Wemby is a good rebounder lol. Our rebounding is good whenever he is on the court. He averaged almost 12 rebounds a game in the finals and playoffs in general. Similar numbers in regular season too. His contested rebounds rate and box out rate is also fairly good. This is such a casual fan opinion but again this sub is garbage and is no different than hot take artists like SAS at this point so people will just upvote anything negative Wemby related at this point. You can type he is actually a bad defender and you might get upvoted.
And the fact that he challenges every shot gets him in a difficult position to rebound. That’s why spurs need a rebound machine 4 who can catch the boards when Wemby makes the opponent miss the shot
He got boxed out so easily by Mitchell Robinson on a defensive free throw at the end of one of the last finals game.
What is that
Mitch Robinson literally got a game 5 winning offensive rebounds near the end of the game because he knows how to box out and fight for the board, vs Wemby, who was facing away from the rim for some reason.
Because Wemby, considering his size, is an awful rebounder. He is the prime example of a guy who just jumps at the ball an tries to use his length, terrible positioning and boxing
That’s because he’s quite young, and he’s quite tall. Dude has never had to compete with guys of similar size. He has never had to do trenchwork because he’s so tall. Not a single coach probably told him he needed to position better and box out, because with his length alone he’s getting an adequate number of rebounds.
Not a single coach probably told him he needed to position better and box out
Wemby has said himself that all his coaches have tried to make him play like a center but he prefers to play like a guard
If he wants to play like a guard, he needs to really improve his playmaking and shooting. Maybe he should try listening to his coaches because this version of Wemby isn’t winning a title.
This version of Wemby had a PG playing for the other team and one playable guy off the bench and every game in the Finals was still close. But yeah, unimaginable that such a player could actually go all the way.
Also saw wemby throw a bad pass off Castles back and miss back to back clutch FTs. Fox was bad but wemby wasn’t error free.
Yeah Wemby had some stinker moments but FTs and TOs are fixable. The point your replying to is about whether Wemby should fundamentally change his player identity to become a championship player. And like OP, I agree that is ridiculous given how close he got as a 22y.o. with a team full of pups.
Is this where the “Wemby has no help” narrative begins? Because this team was favored, their big guards were supposed to shut down the Knicks offense, and they had home court advantage.
dude I don’t care if every game was close. Losing the series 4-1 means you weren’t close
Buddy they lost by a combined like 12 points over 5 games. A few plays go their way and this version of Wemby would be a champ. Completely ridiculous to act like he needs to remake his game in order to win a title when they damn near did in his third year
I didn’t say remake it, he needs more tools in the toolbox. That’ll come with experience and actually trusting his coaches.
Dude clearly did not know how to get to his spots when it mattered and he’s got no midrange or postgame. The crazy part is that their rookie was able to be everything wemby should’ve offensively. Like harper is genuinely terrifying
To think a coach has never thought to teach him how to box out, especially when he’s been in the NBA for years is absolutely mental.
The trouble is that in the biggest game of his life he was lacking in the ability to secure the rebounds that mattered most.
Numbers are nice, but the vast majority being lightly contested mid game just won’t give him the experience needed to get heavily contested late game rebounds.
He needs to learn to box out.
Correct. As a Cade fan I can say how amazing he was for us, but there were times in important moments where he had a terrible lazy TO. Same as wemby with TOs or giving up boards. It’s a game of possessions in playoffs and finals. One fuck up could cosy you the game and the series, as seen.
Long and lanky
High center of gravity and not enough girth or base to box out well
Relies on his length out of necessity
Great rebounders are generally thick af. Think Barkley and Zach Randolph frames
Wemby, considering his size, is an awful rebounder
Being beaten on a rebound by Mitchell Robinson while gassed from playing 40 minutes as a 7’6 guy doesn’t make you a bad rebounder, it just makes you a worse rebounder than the best (or 2nd best) offensive rebounder in the league. He just averaged 11.5 rebounds in 29 minutes a game. He’s not the greatest rebounder but he’s not awful.
That one O board isn’t the only time it’s happened. He’s bad for his size. He stills gets a ton, but not due to boxing or positioning.
Wemby faced Mitchell because pushing forward rather than pushing backwards provides more leverage. Wemby just isn’t strong enough and center of gravity is too high to move someone like Mitchell Robinson.
Turning and pushing is NOT prime boxing out! A simple, BASIC move that TODAY’S NBA rarely utilize, along with properly setting PICKS!
Mitch wasn’t much better at 22
I swear Wemby is like a science experiment. They put Mo Cheeks into Manute Bol’s body. It’s like he forgets he’s tall until he’s at the rim.
Gortat and Nene getting a shout out. We get so little love for quality guys who dont make the all star.
Its good to see some of our squad get some love. The 2010’s were so much fun.
It’s gonna get fun again next season, finally.
I remember one of the wiz games I went to as a teenager, Nene had such a good game it was so sick to see.
We still lost though.
Another summer quest for Wemby is loading if he sees this
I mean this is legitimately one of Wembys biggest weaknesses, he gets covered for it a bit because sometimes he’s just so tall it doesn’t matter. I have no doubt this was something he was going to be working on regardless
I feel like this is just a natural weakness for wemby. It’s difficult to fight for position when you have a higher center of gravity than most/all humans.
If he’s contesting shots he’s not going to be in position to rebound anyways. And he can tip a good portion of rebounds regardless
Copy paste:
The fact that Wemby challenges every shot gets him in a difficult position to rebound. That’s why spurs need a rebound machine 4 who can catch the boards when Wemby makes the opponent miss the shot.
Yeah it’s actually crazy how often he has horrible positioning on the rebound and lets his man in front of him, then grabs the board anyway because he’s got six inches on everyone else on the floor.
There’s not much Wemby can do.
His center of gravity is high as hell and him putting in more weight not only endangers his career with vastly increased risk of injury, but it just defeats the purpose entirely, a lot of the things that he does that are alien is precisely because he’s nimble for a guy that is 7’5 tall.
We just calling normal practice summer quest now because its Wemby
People who think Shaq wouldn’t dominate lol
Wemby would be in the hospital if shaq ever decides to go at him.
Shaq is weird because Shaq is so extremely a product of his times. He could not shoot. He couldn’t make free throws. He couldn’t guard the perimeter past like age 26. He demanded touches in the post, so much so that he basically stopped playing any defense if he didn’t get enough shots up. He straight up committed felony assault and sexual assault as a hazing ritual on a consistent basis. He had suspect health even in an era which required dramatically less conditioning. All of those things just doesn’t fly anymore.
But also despite those flaws he is unambiguously a top 20 player of all time. He would absolutely bully most centers nowadays in the paint and could probably box out nearly every center in the league but in my opinion, at least in the modern era, (hyper important caveat) Gianni’s does everything Shaq could do but with dramatically better conditioning and attitude.
Top 20?
Could make a very solid argument that Shaq is like the 5th greatest player ever
Giannis still doesnt compare offensively imho as a finisher. Shaq was on another level on the block. Giannis also has a way less robust skillset inside the paint in the half court and is much easier to guard with the right gameplan imho. Shaq in his prime was so dominant he was practically unstoppable
Feel like this is underestimating Shaq tbh
Shaq was insanely hyper competitive and I suspect it still works. Zion honestly is a great comp to Shaq and for all the shit we give Shaq he was never nearly as bad shape as Zion. Zion dominantes when healthy, Shaq would still be great. Shaq for his bully bull still had some incredible footwork and moves, even at his biggest, his post up to spin was impossible to guard.
Orlando and early lakers Shaq is better than Giannis ever was and im saying this as a huge Giannis fan
Its really not even close, and that’s not a slight to Giannis - Shaq was just that fucking good. There’s never been anyone else like him in NBA history. His Lakers prime is one of the most dominant peaks of all time. I’ve never seen another player make defenses look completely helpless like Shaq did.
I really like this framing, because it makes you wonder what players today struggle because their body isn’t built for today’s game. It’s like, these days you need to be a stud endurance athlete, plus explosive laterally, plus durable, and strength is secondary.
Take Zion Williamson - he has all the talent and physical strength to succeed, but couldn’t stay healthy, and the game has kind of moved away from him. But drop him into the 90s or aughts, with less lateral movement, he just has to jog, jump up and down once, and not run for closeouts. While he doesn’t benefit from 2020s science keeping his body right, maybe he doesn’t get as injured playing big, can dominate physically, and withstand that type of pounding better.
Maybe he gets way fewer reps in high school too, and doesn’t wear out his body by the time he’s in the NBA.
People get it the wrong way.
Folks say shaq could not dominate with this outside shooting era and there are no dominant bigs because of that… it’s the other way around…
This shooting era can exist because there is no shaq lol
I just cannot comprehend the mind of people like that. Dude was 7’1” 320 pounds and in his prime moved like a guard. He wasn’t just size either he had skill.
He legitimately during his peak might have been the most dominant force we’ve seen in basketball since maybe Wilt. Monstrous player
Just watching him go through and over people was wild. He’d be dunking on people with like three people hanging all over him. Just carrying them with him
If Shaq had been even halfway motivated to keep his weight in check, less of a giant baby, and stayed hungry to win longer, we’d be talking about him and Jordan for the GOAT with Lebron a distant third.
Shaq would average 35 15 and 3, on like 75 fgpct and take like 10-20 from the line every game lol
I do feel like boxing out is becoming a lost art within the NBA when it comes to Bigs doing it regularly, The worm was someone who was damn near a master at it and he gets his flowers for it.
It’s absolutely infuriating watching guys just try to grab someone instead of actually boxing out. The whole point of boxing out properly is to push a guy away from the basket. Grabbing them doesn’t do that and allows them to still go for the board…
Yep some guys box out and but they don’t seal their man out so they don’t get the board, it’s like at times the fundamentals aren’t taught as strict as they used to be taught.
it’s like at times the fundamentals aren’t taught as strict as they used to be taught.
Tbf haven’t we been saying this for at least a dozen years? Thats why Duncan was The Big Fundamental.
they haven’t been taught in decades really, this is the aau ball shit
pretty much all these guys grew up on loaded teams with way more size and talent and athleticism, rebounds and defense were somebody else’s job, they could just go jump for them whenever they want
I think of it when it comes a lot to the Bucks teams. Everyone praised Giannis rebounding and would miss Brook absolutely being a box out king. However, he also was not at the insane usage rate for it as they had him used in many ways, but he still knew how to do the dirty work.
Unfortunately now people want the space the floor skill set Brook developed, ignoring the boxing out and rim protection that made him so valuable. Guys like Adams & MRob are going to have roles forever if they are healthy as they can just change a big game with their rebound battles.
Yeah. It was similar for Westbrook on OKC with Adams. He basically cleared the lane for Westbrook to grab the board and go coast to coast.
Adams is insanely good at exploiting the fake box-outs that are really just grabs, too. I wouldn’t want to call that tank of a man a flopper but when Steve-o catches you grabbing instead of positioning, he’s going to make sure the ref notices. Draws an incredible amount of rebounding fouls that should really be added to his offensive rebound stats.
its downright embarrassing watching bigs in today’s game unable to do basic things.. Ive been saying it for years, look at the bodies around the hoop anytime a shot goes, rarely do you see a player find the closest opponent and box them the hell out
pick setting is also a lost art, despite being in a league that operates and runs the pick n roll more then ever, the angles taken just never make any sense or add up in the slightest
yup, this is my shit with the constant, ‘everybody is so much more skilled today,’ like, the skills have changed, boxing out and entry passes are basically extinct lol.
picks are another great example, so many terrible picks despite the refs letting you set nfl blocks lol
You don’t even have to be THAT big. Albeit small sample size, but Tatum averaged 10 rebs a game this season purely off good positioning and boxing out. He’s been improving at it every year, it’s one of my favorite things about him tbh. Despite all the other shit he does he’s still down there fighting for boards.
Kevin Love in his Minnesota days dominated the boards. He had a season averaging 15 boards a game. The dude was the opposite of athletic for the NBA. He simply understood positioning and had great timing.
I swear to god the pelicans players knew how to box out we would have 10 additional wins each of the last 4 years
Wish Duren knew how to box out. Sigh
Duren really makes you appreciate Dwight Howard’s skills. He was always described as all physicality but he was giving you a lot of post moves that work against guys that are as big as he is. JD really looked lost when someone his size stayed home instead of switching.
That’s my Aquaman
> Nene & Marcin Gortat
This is such a HUGE point.
Those dudes weren’t ’the best’, they were average. And they had, in their era, a base level of skill - boxing out, positioning, rebounding - that contributed to the ‘environment’.
Adams isn’t saying Adams is ‘the best’ - he clearly says he is not - Adams is saying that HIS PARTICULAR SET OF SKILLS is different from his current peers and that difference is how Adams is so successful as an offensive rebounder.
Adams is a ‘dinosaur’ from another era. He’s an Emu. The modern game is an Australian officer with a Maxim gun. The Emus won a ‘war’ against that Aussie with a Maxim gun. (True story!)
Adams is also saying (without saying) that if Prime Wilt were to arrive in a Time Machine next year, he’d average 20+ rebounds a game, even with far fewer attempts and misses than in his era. Wilt’s BBIQ would give him a massive, triple-Adams advantage in Rebounding compared to modern players.
It’s true
This speaks to the broader argument today that players in this era are more ‘skilled’ than past players.
It’s not as clearcut as that. To some extent it’s true, but Steph all but eradicated physical, paint-dwelling bigs (this lead to more spacing in the paint), players are better from 3 but most of them have poor/no midrange game (3s require off ball movement and separation moves like the step back, midrange requires more complex footwork, you can work with your back to basket etc), a lot of bigs today can’t box out, have poor post moves etc
They’re not completely ‘more skilled’ today, they are moreso ‘differently skilled’ (but I’ll concede there are more star level/high volume scorers today)
This has always been my stance. Skills of all positions have been swapped out and some have been lost to time. The average center doesn’t deploy flip shots or drop steps either. Proper post passes are not standardized guard skills today.
Roy Hibbert was also among the last successful “old-school” defensive anchor centers whose offense was built around post ups and jump hooks before the NBA fully shifted toward spacing and three-point shooting.
If anybody doubts that, see the 2013 playoffs when he did that to the Knicks in the 2nd round.
Wait till after the parade ends man smh
that’s why looney forever warriors goat
man’s role is just to rebound and that’s it.
This morning I was 100 percent sure I’m not gay
Nobody boxes out, it drives me crazy. My HS coach would kill me if I jumped after a rebound instead of boxing out my defender and he came flying and took it from me, and it seems like a regular occurence nowadays lol.
Robinson offensive rebound and OG putback were executed because of boxing out and lack thereof.
Big men shouldn’t be hanging around the 3-point line, get your ass in the trenches for some rebounds and tip-ins.
He’s right.
Hes not wrong
They’re not good at it also because they refuse to even do it most of the time.
it’s not just the nba either. i see the same thing in pickup — too many guys watch the shot instead of finding a body. boxing out is literally the easiest way to contribute without the ball. steven knows what’s up
Adams should consider voiceover work in retirement.
League is walking away from it’s base skillset.
He’s not wrong
Hes right
Brook Lopez will always be my unofficial king of boxing out in New Jersey.
Even though it would lead to jokes about how a 7ft Center had terrible rebound numbers Lopez would still box out 2-3 guys and allow his PF and SF to feast.
Kris Humphries averaged a double double in back to back seasons on the Nets because of BroLo.
If you’ve seen Evan Mobley and Jarrett Allen play for 5 minutes than you know this is true
Honestly, post-up moves have gone the way of the dodo, too.
Today’s NBA fans don’t appreciate true post-up artists like Hakeem and Kevin McHale. They would put a dozen moves on their defender in order to get them to leave their feet, all the while Hakeem and McHale never lifted their pivot feet.
Can we please get this guy and pair him with Jokic? Please, sincerely a nuggets fan
jokic is really good at getting rebounds and boxing out…i dont get ur comment
I want to be able to play with some sort of twin towers.
ye but steven adams aint it,he has very similar weaknesses as jokic,i dont think it gets better than (healthy) aaron gordon
They need a center who can do anything in off-Jokic minutes. Though I would have preferred if they got him after their championship run, that would have been a big difference maker.
bUt tOdAy’s pLaYeRs aRe mOrE sKiLLeD tHaN tHe PlUmErS oF ThE 80’s aNd 90’s.
One of my favorite personalities in the game, and easily the most protective of our planet.
BOY, is THIS good to hear, because the boxing out is TERRIBLE, along with setting fuckin PICKS that’s taught in ELEMENTARY!!!!
I’m told decent at the sexy “trench work” around the box
as a straight guy - damn he’s good looking
The twink build isn’t going to box out well
the analytics back him up here — offensive rebound rate has been steadily declining for a decade. coaches have been pulling bigs out of the paint on shots to get back in transition, and boxing out just isn’t prioritized the same way. it’s not that guys can’t do it, the math just doesn’t favor it anymore.
Should do voice overs or even some audio books once he retires!
Tbf they’re also not as strong as a greek god.