coak81

214 | 5 days ago

People forget Dave Cowens has 2 rings and an MVP

kill-devil-films

76 | 5 days ago

Cowens is really a forgotten man when discussing NBA history

Orphanpuncher0

15 | 5 days ago

He was at an event at a school I used to be a custodian at and I didn’t know he was there until one of the other custodians mentioned it after the fact. I was so sad haha

Alternative-Farmer98

1 | 3 days ago

It’s really hard to pick a fourth one behind the big three. Cowens, Sam, Jojo, cousy McHale.

Skindigity_

25 | 5 days ago

wow just checked his stats. Damn crazy! How did he get MVP but then picked on 2nd All NBA team?? Surely everyone blew up about that?

halobeni | Kung Fu Joe’s terrorism prosecutor

27 | 5 days ago

back then players vote for the MVP

and many of them didn’t fuck with Abdul-Jabbar.

walter_____pinkman

12 | 5 days ago

No hate to Cowens but his MVP’s a candidate for biggest robbery in the history of the award lol, 100% belonged to Kareem.

NChSh | Bill

7 | 5 days ago

And he won it in 73 beating out Kareem! It’s not like he got it over “a bunch of plumbers.” I just looked and Cowens averaged 20 points and 16.4 rebounds that year, but was only 3rd in rebounding ha. People missed a lot of shots back then! Jokic lead the league with “only” 12.9 this year, Wilt had 18.6 in 73

PitifulEconomics562

4 | 5 days ago

My dads favorite player of all time

asanoayaki | Lukembe Kornet my beloved

98 | 5 days ago

I think he has to have one more ring and atleast one major award

AdElectrical4835

32 | 5 days ago

I don’t think he needs another ring to pass Paul tbh given he only got 1 himself

TheDGP42

21 | 4 days ago

Half of Pierce’s career was spent elevating scrubs. JT has always had stacked teams. Honestly, I hate this conversation. Guy is good. Have this conversation at the end of his career.

dirty_water_5698

3 | 3 days ago

His rookie playoff run was legendary. The refs had to fouls him out in game 7 to stop him from demolishing Kareem’s record

TheDGP42

1 | 3 days ago

I honestly thought PP and Antoine Walker were the future of the NBA.

asanoayaki | Lukembe Kornet my beloved

5 | 5 days ago

Honestly looking at it I agree

wrongitsleviosaa | RAPGP

3 | 5 days ago

If he’s a lifer then no, he doesn’t need much of anything anymore. Maybe a FMVP but that would come with a ring lol.

KOBE_GYN

1 | 5 days ago

He also didn’t win a major award. Pierce clears as of now but things would have to be disastrous for that to be the case in a couple years

LarBrd33

17 | 5 days ago

Pierce peaked out as a 2nd team all nba player for a single season. Tatum was a 4x first teamer. Tatum also has had more playoff success than Pierce already. Paul spent his first 9 seasons missing the playoffs 5 times and even after KG arrived and started carrying him to success, the total series wins doesn’t compare to Tatum.

Basically all Paul had over him is that bullshit fmvp award but truthfully Tatum should have won over brown and kg should have won over Pierce. Tatum was the literal best player on a title team. Pierce never was.

k-seph_from_deficit

26 | 5 days ago

Pierce was competing for 2 forward spots v LeBron, Tim Duncan, Dirk, Garnett, peak TMac etc. The 00s was a period most flooded with forward talent.

HoppyPhantom | THE TRUTH

13 | 5 days ago

Lmao guess those Finals appearances don’t hit quite as hard when you read about them in a box score, huh sport?

Arguing that KG carried that 2008 team is wild.

LarBrd33

-6 | 5 days ago

bro I’m almost certainly older than you and I watched them. You’re outing yourself as someone who just watches scoring highlights.

I watched those games. Kg carried Pierce. Tatum carried brown. Facts

HoppyPhantom | THE TRUTH

6 | 5 days ago

Someone hits you with “you only looked at box scores” and your response is “well you only watch highlights”? I thought age was supposed to come with wisdom lol.

I don’t care what you claim to have watched. Saying that KG carried Pierce to that 2008 title just doesn’t align with reality.

LarBrd33

1 | 4 days ago

Only someone who watched scoring highlights would think Pierce was the best player on that team. Kg carried his ass. Without KG, Pierce’s legacy is a poor man’s Melo

HoppyPhantom | THE TRUTH

1 | 4 days ago

Are you trying to prove you’re older by forgetting wtf we’re talking about?

Your claim was that KG carried Pierce to a title. Not that he was the best player on that team. The first claim is getting dragged because it’s easy to dismiss for anyone who actually witnessed that team. You reframing your original trash take to sound less bullshit doesn’t erase the original claim.

Of course KG was the “best player” on that team. A 7-foot athletic freak who was a defensive anchor, had an arsenal of post moves and a reliable midrange jumper? He was one of one at the time. But the main reason that Big Three was so amazing at all was because of how perfectly their different skill sets complemented each other’s and fit to the style of play in that era.

The synergy on that team was off the charts, which is how I know anyone who claims any of those three was “carrying” either of the other two to a title is full of shit and only reads box scores.

LarBrd33

0 | 4 days ago

Celtics weren’t a good offensive team so why would I care if Pierce averaged 3 more points per game during the finals?

That was a dominant defensive team. It was dominant defensively because KG. He was DPOY. He carried that team and should have won FMVP

nepatriots32

11 | 5 days ago

I agree that Tatum is better than Pierce, but saying KG carried Pierce to a title is a bit much. It’s like saying Tatum carried Brown to a title. Was KG better than Pierce? Yeah, but not by much at that point in time. Keep in mind that Pierce was the team’s leading scorer. If KG truly carried him, why did Pierce end up with the Finals MVP?

It’s incredibly difficult, almost impossible, to win without another elite or near elite player on your team. Jordan never did it. LeBron never did it. Much of the time it took 3 top players to win the finals, like with the 2008 Celtics. The only exceptions I can really think of are Dirk in 2011 and Hakeem in 1994, but Dirk still had an amazing supporting cast. Keep in mind that KG didn’t win without Pierce, either. But given their supporting casts, that shouldn’t be a knock on either of them.

JaDamian_Steinblatt

6 | 5 days ago

KG and Pierce had different jobs. KG was the defensive anchor. Pierce was the #1 option on offense and crunch time closer. KG was also extremely important for the offense, and Pierce was extremely important for the defense. They’re both all-time greats.

One didn’t carry the other, that’s just stupid.

nepatriots32

3 | 4 days ago

Exactly. Although I do think it’s inarguable that KG was the better player at his peak, but he also declined faster than Pierce, so I do think they were of pretty similar importance on the Celtics. And Ray Allen was pretty close to them, too.

Mountain_Driver_7738

1 | 4 days ago

You forgot the team that had zero mega stars lol the 04 Pistons. Wallace was mint but he wasn’t KG or Duncan.

nepatriots32

1 | 4 days ago

True, true. They did have a good amount of pretty good players, but nobody who was super elite. Much better roster than what Pierce had to work with, though, before the Big 3.

LarBrd33

0 | 5 days ago

True in both. Kg carried Pierce. Tatum carried brown.

I put zero stock into FMVP. Iggy over Steph. Them voters just be doing stupid shit for fun

Bodes_Magodes | Tommy

3 | 5 days ago

You’re absolutely delusional if you think KG carried them to a title.

Fuckblackhorses

7 | 5 days ago

Absolutely insane lol, dude put up 41 points against Lebron in a game 7 where the Celtics had 97 points total. The guy was as clutch as they come

LarBrd33

-1 | 5 days ago

It was a mid offensive team. You put too much stock in Pierce barely outscoring kg in that series. That was a team that won because of their elite defense and KG was the epicenter of it. He was 1st team all nba that year, top 3 in mvp voting, and won defensive player of the year. KG carried that team to a title and Pierce got the bullshit FMVP award because it’s a panel of 11 and they like to push narratives and giving some love to the long standing Celtic was cute.

Fuckblackhorses

3 | 5 days ago

Idc about the fmvp award, those are always bullshit. Kg is the better player but saying pp got carried is just dumb blind hate. That team worked because they all made sacrifices but Pierce was the #1 option for a reason and they definitely don’t win without him.

LarBrd33

0 | 4 days ago

Kg was the better player and carried Paul. Without KG, Pierce goes down as a poor man’s Melo

Bodes_Magodes | Tommy

1 | 4 days ago

You’re a disgrace to that username

alecorock

4 | 5 days ago

Not sure why this is being down voted. I don’t think they watched that season as adults.

Bodes_Magodes | Tommy

2 | 5 days ago

The only rationale. You couldn’t possibly watch ‘08 run and the ‘24 and come away thinking Tatum is the better Celtic. C’mon now…Celtic Legends aren’t made from making 1st team All NBA, they’re made from hanging banners. Tommy is forever on my Mt Rushmore anyways…but it’s easy Pierce>Tatum at this point until JT puts the team on his back and adds another one to the rafters

LarBrd33

0 | 5 days ago

I was an adult. It was a mid offensive team. You put too much stock in Pierce barely outscoring kg in that series. That was a team that won because of their elite defense and KG was the epicenter of it. He was 1st team all nba that year, top 3 in mvp voting, and won defensive player of the year. KG carried that team to a title and Pierce got the bullshit FMVP award because it’s a panel of 11 and they like to push narratives and giving some love to the long standing Celtic was cute.

Bodes_Magodes | Tommy

1 | 4 days ago

I’m 42 and this is the first time I’ve ever felt inclined enough to type this… lol

You’re a joke

LarBrd33

0 | 4 days ago

I’m your elder and I can assure you I’m right

Bergy4Selke37

3 | 5 days ago

Every time I read a laughably bad take on this sub, it turns out to be from you.

Just astronomically out of touch with reality, constantly.

JaDamian_Steinblatt

1 | 5 days ago

But don’t you know, he’s old! We should all bow down and accept that he’s right and we’re wrong.

TheOhrenberger

0 | 5 days ago

Paul Pierce wouldn’t make the Mt. Rushmore.

LarBrd33

-1 | 5 days ago

He’s already passed Pierce without question. But if you’re counting awards there’s like a dozen guys who are above both

Cowsox | Take My Achilles

1 | 5 days ago

I’m pretty over the importance of major awards tbh. They do matter to some extent, of course, but there are way too many non-basketball factors going into it. I think 4x all nba first team is nearly as impressive and a bit more representative of the best class of guys in the league at that time.

macklishh |

76 | 5 days ago

I’d take the odds on him getting there..but I think you give it to Cousy then truth and then JT as of now.

TrueReigns

18 | 5 days ago

I give you Cousy, but no way Pierce is better than Tatum or has the better career. And Tatum’s 29.

iamgarron

81 | 5 days ago

Yes but Tatum being 29 matters. We don’t know what the future holds. In a storied franchise, longevity matters, and Pierce being the guy on the team for 15 years is important. This is not the better player or better career, but the better Celtic.

Pierce is

#3 in games

#3 in minutes

#2 in points

#3 in FGM

#1 in 3pm

#1 in FTM

# 7 in RBS

#5 in AST

#1 in STL

#3 in Win Shares

macklishh |

20 | 5 days ago

all of this

TTSsox

23 | 5 days ago

The Truth!

MikeVp

6 | 5 days ago

Not all can handle it I’ve heard

SaveHogwarts | HUGO

5 | 5 days ago

Bingo

KOBE_GYN

3 | 5 days ago

🫡

Independent-Mix902

3 | 4 days ago

Tatum turned 28 in March, not 29.

Brown is 29, turns 30 in October.

TrueReigns

-7 | 5 days ago

Listen don’t get me wrong, I like Paul, he’s a great Celtic. And those counting stats prove your longevity point but, it proves mine even more. Because while Tatum may not have those counting stats yet in the all-time Celtics rankings, he’s led the Celtics to more sustained success in less time with MVP-level production for 4+ years, something Pierce never replicated to Tatum’s extent and with both having a ring.

That by itself, not to mention his actual accolades, propels him for sure a few steps ahead of Pierce all-time

Edit: Don’t let nostalgia blind ya, I grew up on Pierce. I saw his ascent. But Tatum in nearly a decade less time has; more playoff wins as a Celtic 75-52 vs 72-64, scored 30+ in playoffs 35 times vs Pierce 16 times, led the Cs to 6 ECF trips w 2 Finals trips and a ring vs Pierce 4 ECF trips w 2 Finals trips and a ring. Lastly, and this is not meant to knock on Pierce, but Pierce wasn’t a floor raiser like Tatum until he got KG and Allen. Up until then he’d only led them to 1 ECF and 3 FR exits. When Tatum has been available for the Cs, he immediately makes them a playoff team at minimum, having only suffered 2 FR exits his entire career, one of which came at the tail end of a season where he returned from an Achilles tear.

longagofaraway | 34

6 | 5 days ago

more playoff wins as a Celtic 75-52 vs 72-64…led the Cs to 6 ECF trips w 2 Finals trips and a ring vs Pierce 4 ECF trips w 2 Finals trips and a ring.

team achievements. pierce never had the sustained level of team around him that tatum has had from the jump

scored 30+ in playoffs 35 times vs Pierce 16 times,

inflated scoring era. pierce did his thing in the lowest scoring era in nba history. tatum in one of the highest.

Teantis

3 | 5 days ago

Also somehow missed zero games after being stabbed 11 times.

That’s half joking as a stat, but part of Pierce’s impact on fans is that things had been pretty bad for a while. Len and Reggie dying, rick fucking pitino, failing to get out of the pretty dreadful east ever. 2008 was really big because it’d been a pretty bad 2 decades where we weren’t really in contention at all for most of it. I really have enjoyed the Tatum Brown pairing and the teams built around them, likeable teams that have always felt in contention. But Pierce sticking through the bad years and then finally getting his title and then nearly getting another isnt capturable in stats. Especially as an overall resurgence of Boston sports that decade after a pretty disappointing 90s across the board.

The only parade Boston saw in the 90s was Bourque’s…. After he won with the Avs.

Edit: oh wait that was in 2001. So no parades.

TrueReigns

1 | 5 days ago

Nah ain’t no way ya are hating on ya own generational player. Especially when said player is a homegrown star that is the best the Celtics have had since Bird. This is actually crazy because I’m seeing other comments in this thread parroting the same nostalgia led stupidity.

IF you’re a Celtics fan, then you should know Tatum’s had to carry multiple times his early years because his only other stars on the team would be injured i.e Kemba/Hayward/Kyrie/Timelord, or not yet who they are now i.e Brown/Smart, or just flat out bums i.e Wanamaker/Langford/Green/Enes/Tacko etc

longagofaraway | 34

1 | 5 days ago

17-18 - KI (AS), AH (AS, DPOY-5, DEF2), JB (DPOY-10), TR (6MOY-10) - 7 double digit scorers

18-19 - KI (AS, NBA2), MS (DPOY-8, DEF1) - 6 double digit scorers

19-20 - KW (AS), MS (DPOY-6, DEF1) - 4 double digit scorers

20-21 - JB (AS) - 4 double digit scorers

21-22 - MS (DPOY-1, DEF1), AH (DPOY-9), RW (DPOY-7, DEF2) - 6 double digit scorers

TrueReigns

1 | 5 days ago

I can tell you’re a Pierce fan. I’m not tryna knock the dude for you. But this is sad because none of this has any context. Injuries, egos, competition. On top of the fact that you’re even putting things like placement finishes for awards for the players like it means anything when you add the context of injuries, diva attitudes, etc. Adding on more insult to injury at this point, you mentioned these players as if there’s so many of them and they were so significant. The best player as a teammate Tatum has ever had is either Kyrie Irving or JB. One lasted a year before imploding, and the other is a watered down version of him who took 6 years to develop. Pierce had the luxury of playing with a top 5 PF OAT, one of the top 4 best shooters in history, and a budding elite floor general. For multiple years.

Edit: I’m sorry, you said JB is a DPOY??????? Hello?????

longagofaraway | 34

1 | 5 days ago

no. i said he came in 10th in dpoy voting.

i guess garnetts knee injury in 09 never happened in your world. i guess kps knee injury in the finals never happened. i guess the multiple years at the tail end of their careers isn’t a thing. it’s all pierce had it easy.

let’s compare the first 5 years of pps teammates

98-99 - 4 dd scorers

99-00 - 2 dd scorers

00-01 - 1 dd scorer

01-02 - AW (AS) - 1 dd scorer

02-03 - AW (AS) - 1 dd scorer

but tatum was ‘carrying’ right? pierce wasn’t apparently.

Subject_Bonus7372

1 | 4 days ago

Wth is these stats? What argument are you making with this useless data?

HoppyPhantom | THE TRUTH

2 | 5 days ago

All of those words and not a single acknowledgement of the massive difference in who Tatum and Pierce were surrounded by? Come on man.

Tatum is elite, but he also won his title on what could be argued was the most talented team in the league—or at least the deepest.

Pierce finally got a respectable roster around him and proceeded to play in two Finals in three years. I also don’t recall him having as much of an issue with choking against inferior competition that this current crop of Celtics seems to be fond of doing.

TrueReigns

1 | 5 days ago

Look at my other comment on this thread. It invalidates everything you said about him being surrounded by better players. Tatum’s title win came on the back of him doing what only 5 or so other players have done on a Championship run on top of his elite defense that shut down his Finals Opp’s entire gameplan in 5 games. Yes he had a historically good team. Said team was also historically good in big part because of him and in spite of some of the players, who were injured. Pierce’s title win came with a historically good team with one of the best Defenses in history, anchored by KG. With at the time the greatest shooter to touch the ball. And they won in 7 games. Man really said Tatum chokes. Hey Siri, who has the most points in a game 7?

Also how is 2 finals in 3 years and a prior history of only 1 ECF with multiple FR exits, better than 2 finals in 3 years with a prior history of 3 ECFs, 1 FR and 1 SR exit? The prior history being done with absolute nobodies but Brown and Smart to go with Tatum

AdderallandButtFuck

1 | 2 days ago

It comes down to Pierce not being soft while Jayson kinda is

Rational-Introvert | The Celtics are the balls

10 | 5 days ago

As of now it has to be pierce tho, no?

k-seph_from_deficit

6 | 5 days ago

‘Easily’ nah, you can’t say that say that about a guy who was just a much more reliable and efficient scorer in the biggest moments in a tougher era to score. Scoring isn’t EVERYTHING but it’s clearly not jut marginally useful. For instance, Pierce after including all the highs and the lows was a 23.5 PP75 adjusted scorer @ +3.2 rTS over 170 playoff games over two decades. Tatum is a 24.8 PP75 @ +0.9. Most importantly, 2 of Tatum’s worst shooting performances came in the NBA finals when all of Pierce’s finals performances are highly efficient.

https://preview.redd.it/qmzkmey0505h1.jpeg?width=1075&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a8dbac72f99be0ab6ce44731369acff242a25005

Pierce should not have been expected to win any first team All NBAs and had a career heavily overlapping with the following ATG forwards: LeBron, Duncan, Dirk, KG, McGrady and later KD. He was additionally competing with multiple time All-NBA players A’mare, Webber, Carmelo, Marion, Bosh and Gasol. He was also shafted by the positions rule at least 4 times.

He was also ahead on the efficiency revolution and had a number of seasons which would have caused him to be viewed very differently today.

These are Pierce’s best scoring seasons adjusted for 2026 TS% per 75 possessions (36 modern minutes approximately). Notice how his efficiency goes supersonic once he had support:

.

²⁰⁰⁰⁄₀₁: 28.9 PP75 @ 63.1 TS%, +5 rTS, 109 ATS

²⁰⁰¹⁄₀₂: 27.7 PP75 @ 63.7 TS%, +5.6 rTS, 110 ATS

²⁰⁰⁴⁄₀₅: 25.4 PP75 @ 64.0 TS%, +5.9 rTS, 110 ATS

²⁰⁰⁵⁄₀₆: 29 PP75 @ 63.1 TS%, +5 rTS, 109 ATS

²⁰⁰⁷⁄₀₈: 23.2 PP75 @ 64.4 TS%, +6.3 rTS, 111 ATS

²⁰⁰⁹⁄₁₀: 22.6 PP75 @ 65.6 TS%, +7.5 rTS, 113 ATS

²⁰¹⁰⁄₁₁: 23.3 PP75 @ 66.6 TS%, +8.5 rTS, 115 ATS

.

TrueReigns

1 | 5 days ago

Tatum sees defenses Pierce dreamed he was seeing during all his playoff runs. His efficiency always took dips because of the level of defense he sees, it’s why his teammates always have career runs. Tatum came back from an Achilles tear and 3 games in teams were guarding and game planning him like he never got hurt. You’re adjusting stats because of the era differences which is useless because reality is far more different than numbers would say. But Tatum back then would absolutely be a more dominant player than Pierce.

You also mentioned those players Pierce had to contend with but he never once was better than any of them or had better seasons other than guys like Marion, Bosh and Gasol. Tell me with a straight face that any of them are better than Tatum. The worse players on that list that you mentioned are not even close to Tatum, yet they were Pierce’s comp? And the best players on that list whom are what Tatum is closing in on being more comparable to, Pierce was NEVER going to be going over them in any individual accolades. Tatum also has had to contend with LeBron, Giannis, Butler, Kawhi, PG, Brown, Embiid, KD for All-NBA and had consistently won over most of them. And that’s just the players on the Eastern Conference.

k-seph_from_deficit

1 | 5 days ago

He had plenty of better seasons than Carmelo and anything other peak McGrady. TD and LBJ are all nba first team of history itself and mid 00s Dirk and KG were monsters who were briefly even better than those guys.

Look, Tatum is a great player but my point is he was not contending with a murderer’s row of forwards for his slot like the 00s. Let’s look at what actually happened:

In all 3 years that Tatum was first team with positional rule, Giannis was the first forward picked. These are the forwards Tatum beat under the 2 forwards rule:

2022: 1. KD (0.001 MVP vote shares out of 100 (¹⁄₁₀₀₀) - which is = 1 fifth place vote) 2. Demar Derozan, (tied with KD for 1 fifth place vote) 3. LBJ (tied with KD and DDroz for 1 fifth place vote) 4. Pascal Siam (no MVP votes)

2023: 1. Jimmy Butler (0.003 vote shares out of 100 (³⁄₁₀₀₀) which is = 1 third place vote) 2. Jaylen Brown (no MVP votes) 3. LBJ (no MVP votes) 4. Julius Randle (no MVP votes)

2024: 1. KD (0.001 MVP vote shares out of 100 (¹⁄₁₀₀₀) which is = 1 fifth place vote) 2. Kawhi (no MVP votes) 3. LBJ (no MVP votes) 4. Sabonis (0.003 vote shares out of 100 (³⁄₁₀₀₀) which is = 1 third place vote)

In all 3 seasons, none of the players above got more than 1 voter out of 100 to give them one vote.

And in the positionless era:

2025: 1. LBJ (0.016 MVP vote shares out of 100 (¹⁶⁄₁₀₀₀), 2. Jalen Williams (no MVP votes).

In fact, the strongest forward Tatum won first team ahead of in MVP votes was the 2025 version of 40 year old LeBron with 16 out of 1000 MVP vote shares who had a on/off of -5.3 (first negative in his career) and a negative plus/minus for the first time in his career.

Tatum was MUCH better than those forwards in those seasons to be clear and got hundreds of MVP vote shares out of 1000 every season. But my point is they are not comparable at all to the guys hogging the ALL-NBA first teams during PP’s peak who were the best players of the era during their primes and not the type to get 1 voter out of 100 to give them one MVP fifth or third place vote).

This is not to say PP is better than Tatum or vice versa. I’m just saying using All-NBA teams to compare them is an exercise fraught in fraudulence like comparing Dwight Howard to Patrick Ewing, who was top 5 in MVP voting five times but never made 1st team because his peak coincided with Hakeem, David Robinson and Shaq.

[deleted]

4 | 5 days ago

[deleted]

cstar84

2 | 5 days ago

Correct - I know this because I’m a day older than him. But I am still not 100% awake yet so when I read that Tatum was 29 I had to ask myself for a few seconds how old I was lol.

TrueReigns

1 | 5 days ago

100% right, I mix up Tatum and Browns age often

cpsmith30

2 | 5 days ago

Don’t be a fool. Down by 1 and 15 seconds to go, you take Paul pierce over Tatum every single time

TrueReigns

1 | 5 days ago

Tatum is over 50% on shots made with under 24 seconds to go during crunch time situations. Pierce shoots 35%. Tatum shoots over 50% his career for crunch time with under 5 to go. Pierce shoots sub 40%. Even adding context like what he did certain seasons. Pierce’s best is 51%, Tatum 58%. Tatum’s worst would be one of Pierce’s best.

cpsmith30

0 | 4 days ago

Dude Tatum has so many turnovers and sometimes doesn’t get a shot off at all. Take that into account.

AdderallandButtFuck

1 | 2 days ago

It’s not about the more talented player overall. From a Celtics franchise perspective , Pierce is higher than Tatum in the Mount Rushmore candidate list. Pierce was a clutch no fear gamer and won the hearts of Boston fans. Tatum for years now has not been a gamer despite being a more talented player (I will die on the hill that Tatum lost that confidence factor when Bam stuffed him wt the rim. He hasnt had that killer instinct to the rim since). Pierce has that eye test “it” factor over him.

TrueReigns

1 | 2 days ago

Nothing here that you said is backed by any facts. All you Pierce diehards are literally just going by vibes and feelings

Suitable-Answer-83

4 | 5 days ago

I’d even consider Cousy ahead of Havlicek. First Celtic to win the NBA MVP, 13x All Star, 12x All NBA, 8x assist champ, and 6 rings is quite the resume.

Granted, Hondo’s 13x All Star, 11x All NBA, and 8 rings are nothing to scoff at.

All of which is to say it is a tall order even for a surefire Hall of Famer to crack the top 4.

IKenDoThisAllDay

-5 | 5 days ago

Tatum over Pierce imo. I tend to favor peak over longevity and Tatum has already had at least a couple seasons better than any of Pierce’s. Give it time and Tatum will likely beat him in longevity too.

This isn’t criticism of Pierce, it’s more praise for Tatum. I grew up watching Pierce and will always have a soft spot for him, he was the guy on the Celtics for most of my early years watching them. I just see Tatum as a more impactful and well-rounded player.

Eisenhorn76 | 11-1 is far superior to 4-6 in the Finals

47 | 5 days ago

Before we even start talking about Pierce: Dave Cowens won 2 titles and was MVP during Kareem’s heyday.

Any Rushmore talk has to include Dave before we start talking about Paul or Jayson.

MeddlingMike | The Celtics are the balls

39 | 5 days ago

Look at Bob Cousy and Dave Cowens resumes and get back to me.

PebblyJackGlasscock | Second Round Pick Enthusiast

17 | 5 days ago

Yup.

Heck, Tommy Heinsohn is also in contention for that 4th spot. Who’s greater in history than Tommy?!

Dunder72

17 | 5 days ago

You just got a Tommy point.

JackJ98 | WE DID IT ☘️

7 | 5 days ago

2024 was the first Celtics ring that Tommy didn’t play a part in

frauenarzZzt | Ray

3 | 4 days ago

Heinsohn is in the HoF as a player and a coach and a broadcaster. Only Bill Russell and Red Auerbach have meant more to the organization. Bird was incredible, but after he left Boston he left Boston. Tommy stayed for 6 decades, Auerbach stayed for 4 decades, and Russell was always a Celtic.

MeddlingMike | The Celtics are the balls

2 | 4 days ago

I LOVE WALTAH!

chrishooley

32 | 5 days ago

He’s the 6th man right now. Bird, Russel, Havlicek, Cousey, Peirce, Tatum barely beating McHale IMO

ZizzyBeluga

18 | 5 days ago

Man at least spell Cousy and Pierce correctly

ChickenRat_

6 | 5 days ago

pel perce

crashtesting123

24 | 5 days ago

I really think by the end of his career he will be. Winning a couple more rings wouldn’t hurt either.

samsun387

25 | 5 days ago

No

Angreek

15 | 5 days ago

No

PebblyJackGlasscock | Second Round Pick Enthusiast

16 | 5 days ago

Not enough mentions of Tommy Heinsohn, man of many rings as a player, won another as a Coach, and then nursemaided most of us through the TV broadcast for decades.

Tommy is one of the four most important Celtics.

ChickenAndTelephone

7 | 5 days ago

Tommy won two as a coach

th3dandymancan | Grant Candle

1 | 5 days ago

Strong agree.

dddfgggggdddfff | Tommy

11 | 5 days ago

I feel like it’s not fair to judge people’s legacy while they’re still playing… let’s just enjoy the ride of a great player. Ask us again in however, many years he plays when he retires. that’s the time for this question.

firedliquid5

10 | 5 days ago

I’d say the Mount Rushmore of Celtics are Russel, Bird, Havlicek, and Cowens

cpsmith30

1 | 5 days ago

I’d agree with you but Paul pierce was my favorite Celtic of all time. Cowens definitely deserves a spot though. We’d need a bigger mountain. Tommy deserves a spot too.

Best-Author7114

2 | 4 days ago

Cousy HAS to be on there.

DKY_207 | Huge PP fan

8 | 5 days ago

Tatum isn’t in the top 4 yet, but he’s in the 5-8 range in my opinion. In another 5+ years on the same trajectory as his pre-injury self (All-NBA player, possibly another championship), I see him easily being in that group with Bird, Russell, and Havlicek.

Big3ver3 | Bll Russell

7 | 5 days ago

Not yet for me, but that’s FAR less a comment on Tatum than it is the sheer volume of incredible players the Celtics have had.

whaleinapuddle | KG

5 | 5 days ago

Not that he can’t get there but its a top-2 most competitive hierarchies and he isn’t there yet. I don’t think he’s really in the discussion for 4 either TBH.

Past the 3 you mentioned, Its Pierce vs. guys like Cowans, Cousy, McHale - then past that tier you start arguing guys like KG (6 seasons 1 ring) vs. Tatum (9 seasons 1 ring). He’s in the top-10 but I can’t really see top-4 being argued without a lot of recency bias yet.

RecognitionSea613

0 | 5 days ago

Don’t forget kg had already gone 14 seasons with Minnesota plus the 6 for boston. He was in his 20th year when he got done in boston. Kinda not fair to put just his time on celtics vs Tatums whole career.

AddsJays |

6 | 5 days ago

He really needs an MVP or 2 more rings to even start the conversation. His first team selections already make him on pace.

Personally my top 4 is Bill Larry Cousy Havlicek. Havlicek gets in because of his 8 rings and less importantly FMVP and all time scoring.

If he gets 2 more rings and an MVP he should be top 4. So far he’s just in top 10, behind people like Cowens, McHale, Parish, Pierce, maybe Sam Jones Tommy.

OrbisChap

5 | 5 days ago

Noooooooo. Long way to go.

totheruins1

6 | 5 days ago

Not even close tbh

Oceanbreeze871 | Angry Brad

4 | 5 days ago

With only one banner, he can’t really be for this franchise. There’s too many guys

LegoTomSkippy

4 | 5 days ago

Everyone is settled on Russell, Bird, Havlicek. It’s the last spot that everyone is arguing about.

I say Auerbach. Don’t argue over a weak 4th spot with Red there. If Tatum deserves it, he’ll carve the spot himself.

Spiritual-King9898

1 | 3 days ago

If you put Red on there you’re accounting for non-playing contributions, and if you’re accounting for non-playing contributions you don’t leave off Heinsohn. And then you have Russell, Bird, Red, and Heinsohn

I love Tatum, but good fucking luck breaking into THAT mountain

MWave123

4 | 5 days ago

Chips matter. Look up. What do you see?

frauenarzZzt | Ray

2 | 4 days ago

BANNERS IN THE RAFTERS.

DrJr23

3 | 5 days ago

No too many great Celtic legends. Need to win more rings and major awards. Dave Cowens has 2 championships and an MVP for us.

Rich_Explorer_682

3 | 5 days ago

Not at all

WilFlo

3 | 5 days ago

Probably a better question when Tatum retires

Agreeable_Mousse2850

3 | 5 days ago

No….not at all.

TheOneWhosCensored | Bird

2 | 5 days ago

Personally I’d put Cousy over Hondo, but those are the 4 until JT can push one of them off. Unless you include non-players, in which case it’s gotta have Red.

SerfTint

2 | 5 days ago

No. I have him currently 9th in Celtics history, which he should move up from, but this is a franchise that has 18 rings and he only has one of them, despite being on a Top 5 team in the league for nearly his entire career. Also, he has finished one season healthy in the last 5. Cousy won an MVP, Cowens won an MVP. Heinsohn won 8 rings in a 9-season career. Tatum still has a long way to go even to reach the breadth of Sam Jones’ and Kevin McHale’s careers.

He has a shot at these things, but we’re seriously overvaluing him if we’re putting him in the all-time greats category at this point.

lossincasa | KG

1 | 5 days ago

Yeah, it is too early to even discuss these matters, let’s see how it ends. In this era everything is done in a hurry, but history is written slow and with time.

lotofry

2 | 5 days ago

Pierce is Mount Rushmore

seppok33

2 | 5 days ago

I love JT, but the answer is no. The 4th is Cousy. End of discussion.

The thing with the Celtics is that the second tier of our Rushmore (players 5-8) are better than virtually every other team’s first tier with the (possible) exception of the Lakers.

Hell, our third tier is still probably better than the top four of most of the league.

Best-Author7114

0 | 4 days ago

The Cousy disrespect is incredible, and sad. That guy invented the PG position and retired as the all time points AND assists leader in NBA history.

IronBush

2 | 5 days ago

No.

Fortress_Of_Fallacy

2 | 5 days ago

The Celtics have so many elite players in their history the 4th spot could be a plethora of players depending on what you’re looking for. Pierce was a great player and had loyalty to the city but I don’t think he’s on the mountain unless you were a big fan of his. Tatum is working toward it but Brown has just as many rings and a FMVP and led a team without Tatum to #2 overall so I think they’re near even so far.

Legend6Bron | Jayson Tatum, The Face of NBA

1 | 5 days ago

I never worry about JT as long as he is healthy, not for a player of his caliber and talent. But I don’t know about the team we will put together around him.

MWave123

1 | 5 days ago

McHale is the better Celtic at this point imo, it’s a different game today but he was an unstoppable force in the paint when that’s how the game was played. 3! Chips, 3 banners in the rafters. Def higher up the ladder than Tatum.

SaveHogwarts | HUGO

1 | 5 days ago

Skill wise, sure you can make the argument, but longevity matters in this discussion and he’s not there yet.

Either-Extension-218

1 | 5 days ago

Good question. I think because of just the 1 title it’s a no. For me, the easy three are Russell. Bird. Havlicek. I’d put Cousy, McHale, or maybe even Cowens over him currently

Cowhide12

1 | 5 days ago

Not yet. Russell, Bird, Pierce, Cowens/Cousy, Havlicek as well. He’s very close, though.

Fungochico

1 | 5 days ago

I this point it would be hard to say yes. With the Celtics historic winning in the past 1 ring doesn’t do it.

DAB12AC | James Posey

1 | 5 days ago

Ricky Davis??

Hello???

Novel_Dog_676

1 | 5 days ago

Pierce clears for now

drossinvt

1 | 5 days ago

This is crazy. And I’m probably going to get slammed for it. But as much as I love Tatum and 4x first team, he’s barely top 10 so far. He might be projecting to be top three by the end of his career but right now I think he’s like 9th in scoring he’s not even in the top 10 in other critical categories like rebounds or minutes played or championships.

Mayonnaise804

1 | 5 days ago

Yes, he is. IMO Tatum game is better than Pierce.

SirCharles14

1 | 5 days ago

Yes

j2e21

1 | 5 days ago

Nooooooo

Baers89

1 | 5 days ago

I love Tatum. But there are so many legendary Celtics. Let him finish his career before we start making calls like this.

HueyLewisFan1

1 | 5 days ago

lol no

Fwiw Bob Cousy was a superstar to leave him out of discussion is blasphemous. As is leaving out Heinsohn

HoraceGrantGlasses

1 | 5 days ago

No lol

TheOhrenberger

1 | 5 days ago

Not yet. Right now he’s on pace to be Paul pierce 2.0 who underachieved. Great player, but not on the Mt. Rushmore of great Celtics players.

jma7400

1 | 5 days ago

Not right now. I would take Pierce and Cousy and maybe even McHale atm. Eventually Tatum will get there.

Merde2000

1 | 5 days ago

with 1 ring? on the top 5 of the most successful team? how? it‘s still about championshis, right?

Overall-Fig870

1 | 5 days ago

I’d say, not yet

Zen2188

1 | 5 days ago

From an outside perspective …

I’ve been a Nuggets fan since the 80s when little ( Alex English & Fat Lever days ) plus I also have a decent grasp on NBA history before I started watching myself.

The Boston Celtics Mt Rushmore is probably the top 1 to ever make the top 4 on

Tatum is a great player but he isnt in that discussion yet.

Only thing you could say about him at this point (imo) is he has kept pace to maybe be in the discussion for it in another 8-10 yrs if he never slips much, wins at least a few more titles, and never leaves the team.

Way premature imo to discuss now

Responsible_Pen2404

1 | 5 days ago

Cousy and Cowens are both higher right now. JT at least has to win another ring for him to be up there.

Jdisback34

1 | 5 days ago

#34

reBrand1980

1 | 5 days ago

I don’t think he is YET, but he could be. I have PP above him at this point, likely to change in 2-3 years.

plato4life

1 | 5 days ago

I would say no.

langjie

1 | 5 days ago

he has great potential to be

th3dandymancan | Grant Candle

1 | 5 days ago

Although he perhaps wasn’t as accomplished as other popular candidates during his time as a PLAYER, I’m surprised Tommy Heinsohn doesn’t get mentioned more.

He played, he coached, and was part of the iconic broadcasting duo with Mike Gorman.

He bled green, and can arguably be given the title of “Mr. Celtic” more than anyone else.

brianw1234

1 | 5 days ago

Nope

thiswayart

1 | 5 days ago

No

bace3333

1 | 5 days ago

No needs 3 Rings

Grantanamo_Bay

1 | 5 days ago

Nope

CA_Mini

1 | 5 days ago

No way. Not with just one ring

Beardiful2002

1 | 5 days ago

Cousy should be there too.

Successful-Pie4237

1 | 4 days ago

LOL, No! Definitely not yet.

Tosman99

1 | 4 days ago

Can we wait till he retires?

bt02124

1 | 4 days ago

Need seven spots on the Celtics mountain.

Jesman1971

1 | 4 days ago

Bob Cousy!! 5 straight titles.

DocRumack80

1 | 4 days ago

I would put Cousy over both Tatum and Pierce

horseshoeoverlook | Boston Celtics

1 | 4 days ago

Nope, I’d argue McHale, JoJo, Cowens, Cousy, Sam Jones, Heinsohn in front of him

dr3wfr4nk

1 | 4 days ago

gif

Quinn_the_eskim0

1 | 4 days ago

Cousy, mchale, cowens, the truth still have a better claim at the fourth spot right now but Tatum is only 29.

Best-Author7114

1 | 4 days ago

Bob Cousy would like a word. You know, the man who retired as the all time points and assists leader in NBA history?

frauenarzZzt | Ray

1 | 4 days ago

What on earth are you talking about? Tatum probably doesn’t even crack the top 10.

If you’re making a “Top 4” it is: Bill Russell, Red Auerbach, Larry Bird, Tommy Heinsohn, outside of that and way ahead of Tatum are at least John Havlicek, Dave Cowens, K.C. Jones, Sam Jones, Bob Cousy, Robert Parish, Kevin McHale, Paul Pierce, Jo Jo White… The list goes on.

Alternative-Farmer98

1 | 3 days ago

Definitely not yet I mean bird Russell havelichak are absolutely on there.

You can make a case for Tatum is 4th but I probably premature. You can make a case for Michael or JoJo or Cowens, cousy …

I think bird, Russell, haviicek are absolute locks

Marvinc1996

1 | 3 days ago

Tatum needs a Finals MVP, it’s going to be tough because the parity of the league.

1sailingaway

1 | 3 days ago

Tatum is still young. The comparison needs to include “at Tatum’s age”. It will be up to Tatum on where he stands at the end of his career.

NumbersAndPolls01

1 | 3 days ago

Never won a Finals MVP. Never won a regular season MVP. Only one signature postseason game (2023 game 7 vs Philly).

Until he starts stepping up in big moments it’s a big time no from me.

YNABDisciple

1 | 3 days ago

It’s crazy as I’m getting older so I still see him as a kid but the numbers are there and he has a ring and has been with us for 9 years. Top 4 though? Bird, Russell, Cousy, Hondo, even Cowens and that doesn’t get to Pierce. I’m sure an argument to be made and it’s not outlandish but I’m not comfy with it yet.

PumpPie73

1 | a day ago

Not yet. Maybe someday

DingBat_77

1 | 10 hours ago

It’s Russell, Bird, Havlicek and Cousy. Then Cowens, McHale, Pierce and Heinson. JT has a lot of work to do to break into that 2nd tier

MundaneExtension3195

1 | 5 days ago

Right now it’s Pierce plus the other 3. Tatum has been great but he’s way behind on career stats, and Pierce had his early career sabotaged by Pitino and then Wyc/Pags buying the team in and rebuilding the thing… Pierce didn’t get Ray & KG until year 10… Tatum has had a huge blessing in that the organizaction has been stable

AdElectrical4835

0 | 5 days ago

I think he will be if he stays at this level for a couple more years he peaked higher than everyone but bird and russell he just doesn’t have the counting stats/awards

yellowboar7

0 | 5 days ago

JT is indeed the best Celtic since Bird

riped_plums123

0 | 5 days ago

No he needs one more title to pass pierce, that title over the lakers and game 7 vs LeBron makes Pierce bigger still.

chydgoo420

0 | 5 days ago

In terms of skill & peak, yes. By the end of his career, he will be by any measure

LarBrd33

0 | 5 days ago

He’s easily ahead of Pierce and in terms of talent maybe only Bird surpasses him, but there’s a ton of guys with more accolades

Enough_Cat3933

0 | 5 days ago

Larry, Bill, Pierce Tatum

NoKangaroo5425

0 | 5 days ago

Cousy, Russell, Bird, Pierce

BosBannerBoss

0 | 5 days ago

gif

Ok_Musician5378

0 | 5 days ago

Current Rushmore is Bird-Russell-Hondo-Cousy-Cowens, then Pierce for the longevity and where he ranks on the team’s various all-time lists. But Tatum is poised to blow past him with a few more healthy years and deep playoff runs.

JaDamian_Steinblatt

0 | 5 days ago

Russell Bird Havlicek Timelord

RedGlovesOverHere

-1 | 5 days ago

Russell, Bird, Pierce, Tatum

Enough_Cat3933

1 | 5 days ago

W

Deep_Attorney2636

-1 | 5 days ago

If we being honest he’s on it but the perception hasn’t caught up yet

bobqzzi

-1 | 5 days ago

This is Danilo Gallinari erasure

Altruistic_Knee2044

-1 | 5 days ago

Yeah.

Bird, Russell, Tatum, Pierce.

Much harder to win in this era, and outside of 2024, he’s been given weak supporting casts.

RDM213

-1 | 5 days ago

I like the idea of having Russel, Bird, Pierce and Tatum on there to represent the eras evenly. It’s a good issue to have that we have too many great players who remained Celtic legends

heyuBassgai

-1 | 5 days ago

He’s a bum, just like jb.

JohnnyMakesMoves

0 | 5 days ago

Be gone pee-on

A-Confused-Comet

-2 | 5 days ago

He is third after Russell and Bird.

askthetruth1

-5 | 5 days ago

Brother Tatum has one ring and less seasons with the Celtics than Pierce and less FMVPs

Is Tatum on the Celtics Mt. Rushmore?

BANNERS IN THE RAFTERS.