510Kyle

632 | 6 hours ago

Being smart realizing kahwi and friends arent contenders, keep the pick

ProfessionalCLA | Spurs

277 | 5 hours ago

Being smarter would be trading Kawhi for picks.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

129 | 5 hours ago

I think it’s taking a great deal if there is one.

I’ve seen people say Butler + 11 is enough, and if that’s the best offer, then I’d rather keep Kawhi and just continue being a play-in level team that’s a bit easier to develop young guys on with his gravity and leadership.

T-Macch | Trail Blazers

54 | 5 hours ago

Between the ongoing investigation and the injury problems always hovering around Kawhi despite his relative healthy stretch lately, getting pick 11 from GS and an injured Jimmy Butler might be a blessing if you’re trying to tank. This draft is stacked and I’m convinced picking twice withing the top 15 will land you 2 solid starters if not future all stars. all this ofcourse with the assumption the Warriors have lost their collective minds and are willing to bet on a Kawhi and Curry core in 2027.

YujiDomainExpansion

41 | 5 hours ago

They aren’t trying to tank though. The Thunder own their draft swap rights next year. They’ll trade Kawhi only if it helps them restore some of the future they’ve lost building around him. Butler and 11th and nothing else? They’ll easily pass on that, win 40 games again, and bring in a top-5 rookie.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

31 | 5 hours ago

This.

People don’t seem to understand that teams consider tanking because it was a strategically beneficial move. When you don’t control your draft capital, there’s literally no reason to do so, especially if the flattening of odds happens.

#11 is cool and all, but that’s not enough to change LAC’s mind to go from “Let’s keep trying to win some games” to “This was enough to help our future that it’s worth it.”

Tapprunner | Spurs

0 | 4 hours ago

I agree, but they also don’t have a young core that is on its way up. A rebuild is inevitable.

Kawhi turns 35 next month and they just got an All NBA-level 65 games from him and they still only won 42 games and got eliminated in the play-in. A healthy-ish Kawhi playing at the level we just saw is the the highest his trade value will be for the rest of his career - He’s 35. It’s not like he still has untapped potential, or that his degenerative knee condition is magically going to get better.

Would you bet more than a dollar on him playing 65 games at that level next year? If he only plays 45 games at a lower level - which is not exactly unlikely - he might not have any trade value at all. Would you delay a rebuild and risk getting absolutely nothing for him in return just so the team can try to win 40 games instead of 30?

I don’t know that not having your pick next year means you should hold on to assets that are going down in value and hurting your eventual rebuild, just for the chance to maybe be a play-in team. You wouldn’t be trading current assets for the purpose of bottoming out - you’d be treating next year’s pick as a sunk cost and trading those assets for something that will help the rebuild.

wielesen

8 | 4 hours ago

they trade kawhi and tank, OKC gets a top 5 pick, why would you want that?

Tapprunner | Spurs

1 | 3 hours ago

So you’d rather hang on to Kawhi, win 38 games and hurt your ability to rebuild when you can’t get anything in return for an old, broken-down Kawhi, because you don’t want OKC to get a high pick?

Don’t cut off your nose to spite your face.

zardmander | Trail Blazers

1 | 3 hours ago

So clips shouldn’t try to build for their future at all to help stop OKC? lol

CaptLeaderLegend26 | Trail Blazers

2 | 35 minutes ago

It’s more like they have no chance to build for their future, so might as well do your best to compete with Kawhi. If we’re being honest, LAC with Ballmer leading them are far more like the Lakers than they are like the Blazers; since they’re in LA, they’ll get stars like the Lakers do so long as they stay competitive.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

5 | 3 hours ago

While some form of rebuild is inevitable, I think people simply vastly overstate this idea of: “You may as well just cash in, no matter how little you get.” Teams need to be flexible and this culture of being okay with tanking and just generally being horrible is bad, and I’m glad Ballmer/L-Frank don’t believe in this.

I think it’s a total disservice to fans to be bad for years and years all hoping that you can luck your way into eventually being a good team. It may have worked for the Spurs, but that doesn’t mean it’s a viable strategy just like playing the lottery isn’t a viable strategy to financial stability.

As mentioned, LAC doesn’t control their own draft pick, so there is no strategic benefit of being bad. The benefit of being a good team is that other players view you as a viable destination, winning builds good culture, and having a stronger team allows for younger players to get some breathing room + better leadership.

In general, I agree that it could be a time to cash in on Kawhi. My specific gripe is that if the best offer is an ACL torn Butler and #11, then that’s a stupid deal and we’re better off just continuing to try to be decent. We’re basically fully embracing being a bottom 3 team for this year (and longer) all to fully bet on whoever we may draft at #11.

I just don’t think it’s worth it at all to be in contention for the worst team in the league all to take one more swing at #11. Basically, I think we should either try to be good or get a good enough haul to properly accelerate our rebuild. Butler + #11 satisfies neither.

Tapprunner | Spurs

1 | 3 hours ago

I think that’s totally reasonable to simply view Butler + #11 isn’t enough return. And you’re right about winning cultures.

Some fans genuinely think “we don’t have our pick, so we should try to be good, no matter what” and they are happy enough to let assets go to waste so they can take a shot at trying to win 40 games. Or that they should base their team building decisions on making sure that the picks they traded years ago don’t ever become high picks. Very much a tail-wagging-the-dog mentality.

I don’t have a lot of faith (don’t look at my flair) that Kawhi will ever really stay healthy and I think the most likely scenario is that he plays two or three more injury-plagued seasons before retiring. So I do think #11 is enough of a return, but I think reasonable people can disagree on that point.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | 2 hours ago

For sure.

Overall, LAC is still in a tough position due to their draft situation + Kawhi, and there’s a very real chance it gets tougher when we get punished for Aspiration.

My very basic point is that LAC needs to be open minded and flexible about the coming years. IMO, based on Lawrence Frank’s approach, he’s either going to continue to trying being good while we maintain flexibility + invest a bit more into the youth movement we have going (Garland, Mathurin, Yanic, + #5) or we get such a good offer for Kawhi that we view it as a meaningful acceleration towards a rebuild.

The 11th pick and Butler doesn’t do that. I actually think last year’s Suns are a good example of the situation we’re in, but they had the added pressure of KD demanding out. And even WITH that, they still got what I think is more appropriate value in a buy low, high upside player in Jalen Green, a quality starter in Brooks, #10 + additional draft capital.

Delanorix | Knicks

-2 | 4 hours ago

Yeah its wild people are saying they’d rather keep Kawhi and go into the playoffs.

There is literally no reason to believe he repeats this years success.

Take the 11th pick and be happy, cause if Kawhi gets hurt early, you’re looking at a 20 win team, IMO.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

8 | 3 hours ago

Take the 11th pick and be happy with definitively being a bottom 3 team? If we whiff on that 11th pick, which is highly possible, then we’re just stuck as basically the worst team in the league without owning our draft capital.

Fans immensely overrate gambling on picks.

Delanorix | Knicks

1 | 3 hours ago

If Kawhi plays only 40 games, what does your team look like?

Tapprunner | Spurs

1 | 3 hours ago

And how is taking a chance on the 11th pick a worse option than letting an expensive asset whither on the vine and getting no pick at all?

And the choice isn’t between “good playoff run” and “bottom 3 team”. Clippers already didn’t make the playoffs. The choice is between “bottom 3 team with a potentially good rookie” or “bottom 8 team with nothing”.

CaptLeaderLegend26 | Trail Blazers

2 | 35 minutes ago

Hey, that pick could become anything. It could even be a player as great as Kawhi Leonard!

One of the worst parts of following American sports is the number of fans who are draft gambling junkies that always want to blow it up when the team loses a game or two.

EDIT: Forgot to mention, you all are in LA, so stars that can’t join the Lakers will be more than happy to join you all with Ballmer running the ship. You’re all better off trying to run yourself like the Lakers and attract stars than throwing everything away to tank.

wielesen

3 | 4 hours ago

Ty Lue went 41-41 with his best 2 players being Reggie Jackson and Norman Powell a couple years back

Tapprunner | Spurs

0 | 3 hours ago

When was that?

‘21-‘22? The 42-40 season when they also had Paul George, Zubac and Terrance Mann in a conference that was weaker than today’s Western conference?

Still, is 42-40 and swept in the first round the outcome you’re hoping for by not using Kawhi as a trade piece to get a real asset back?

Joethetoolguy

6 | 5 hours ago

They cant tank. They don’t have their own pick for quite some time.

Lou_Peachum_2 | Clippers

1 | 2 hours ago

I mean we can… the rest of the league will just be pissed lol

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | an hour ago

There are Spurs fans in these comments actively insisting we should try to be awful. It’s really fascinating that this is happening only like 6 days after a bunch of people here were screaming that OKC was gonna get a Top 3 pick from LAC this draft.

Lou_Peachum_2 | Clippers

1 | 32 minutes ago

It’s funny given how pissy this sub was at the start of the year.

Idk this sub is dumb af, and I hope I never meet anyone here in real life.

Ok-Tree4365

2 | 5 hours ago

Butler is more of an injury concern, a worse leader, and is a less impactful player.

T-Macch | Trail Blazers

0 | 3 hours ago

He earns a lot of money and will barely play, that’s a tanking teams dream right there.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | an hour ago

Except LAC can’t tank.

Frequent-Ferret-5110 | Clippers

2 | 3 hours ago

The Clippers don’t tank, they refused to do it even when they had their picks.

510Kyle

2 | 5 hours ago

Im a warriors fan, warriors are in the same situation so they shouldn’t trade their pick for kahwi, 39 y.o steph and kahwi arent threatening okc/sa/minny, keep the pick and wait it out

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | 3 hours ago

Yeah, tbh I don’t really understand the Dubs and I think your fanbase is really divided which leads to the confusing sentiment.

Feels like half your fans want to “do right” by Steph by getting him win now players, and this was validated by Steve Kerr returning. The other half of your fanbase wants to just keep talent for the future.

Clipper fans are similarly kind of divided, but I think the reasonable ones understand that LAC still doesn’t control their draft capital for 3 years + our team without Kawhi is a bottom 3-5 team… so the most sensible move is to just be smart with assets while generally staying young. If we can’t get a lot for Kawhi, then play him and just keep fighting for those bottom seeds. If we can get a lot for him, then trade him and we’ll be better for the future with whatever haul that is.

510Kyle

1 | 3 hours ago

Yea, feel like there’s steph fans and warriors fans. And you hope the FO doesn’t read into the wishes of steph fans who would be fine with the franchise no longer existing as long as we try hard for the next 2 years before steph retires, even if we dont end up winning it all anyways

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 3 hours ago

I don’t think any FO will make decisions on fan sentiment. You have to trust that they understand the weights of different options and the reality of the situations, but the one thing fans don’t seem to understand is that some franchises are willing to tank and be shit, and others aren’t.

The Warriors and Clippers are not a franchise that will take being awful lightly given their past. Meanwhile, teams like the Jazz have no problem being terrible for multiple years.

510Kyle

1 | an hour ago

Yeah i dont think so either, makes me nervous nontheless when fans of my team start acting desperate for short sighted dumb moves

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | an hour ago

It just makes it way more miserable for discourse, IMO.

I love talking sports, and it’s already hard enough to find someone to talk about the Clippers lmao. The reality is that it’s really tough to team build well, and the Clippers especially have had a tough go of it. In general, mediocre teams have some of the worst discourse because the fans will always find a scapegoat and then present some of the dumbest things ever.

boringexplanation | Kings

2 | 2 hours ago

Fans seem to love discounting the effect of rookies getting into play-in/playoff experience early for purposes of tanking and I don’t get it.

SGA is who he is because he was right there in the mix from his very first year IMO.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | 2 hours ago

Right. Fans have this: “If you’re not first, you’re last” mentality, while not appreciating that a whole lot goes on in these environments. Ironically, LAC can’t even tank, so they don’t even have the out of: “It strategically makes sense to lose as many games as possible!”

What’s funny is with all these anti-tanking talks, you keep hearing: “Well the NFL doesn’t even have the lottery!” Yes, because it’s much more understood in the NFL that you want players playing to win because of the development that comes with that.

Don’t get me wrong, I definitely understand and agree with the appeal of trading Kawhi. But the point is that we don’t have to move him no matter the cost, and everyone acting like there is no benefit to having Kawhi at all is stupid. I keep reading: “You either trade him for something, or keep him and get nothing.” Well yeah, but we keep Kawhi, who is still our best player, and having a Kawhi-level force out there makes it a hell of a lot easier for the young guys to have breathing room on the court.

HighlightsReddit

1 | 2 hours ago

Wasn’t SGA picked 11th? Idk I’d take the pick and live with Jimmy not quite being Kawhi

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | an hour ago

SGA was technically picked 11th, but in practice he was 12th. The Hornets just picked him knowing that LAC wanted him, and they took him with the intention to trade him for Miles Bridges.

But for every good 11th pick, you can point to terrible ones like Jett Howard, Bouknight, etc.

Regarding Jimmy, I think that’s arguably the biggest problem. He’s a total question mark in the locker room, but he’ll likely be worse knowing that he’s an expiring wanting more money. He obviously isn’t going to play the entire season with injuries either.

I’m not saying there isn’t a deal to be done with GSW, but a loose cannon who wants to get paid coming off of an ACL tear + the 11th pick just isn’t very appealing.

bjtrdff

0 | 2 hours ago

You should take that deal if it’s legit. 5 and 11 in a loaded draft is a fucking miracle for the Clippers vs where they were + aspiration.

Kawai and uncle Dennis probably aren’t the mentors you want for the kids.

LehMone

0 | 41 minutes ago

you would 100 percent take that deal as a clipper fan, you’d be dumb not to

stayfrosty | Warriors

-4 | 5 hours ago

Kawhi has leadership?

renhaoasuka | Clippers

9 | 5 hours ago

Yeah he was actually a really good leader for the young guys last year. All the young guys praised him

SilkySmoothTesticles

1 | 4 hours ago

That’s most likely a PR thing because of all the legal troubles and CP3 being tossed unceremoniously

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | 3 hours ago

It’s most likely a PR thing that they coached all of the young players to praise Kawhi’s leadership? Was it also a PR thing that they coached Kawhi to encourage Mathurin and tell him “That’s part of development” when he missed a game winning 3 against the Magic?

Skank_hunt42 | Thunder

12 | 5 hours ago

Realistically, who would trade for him that has the assets? Brooklyn?

IMO, you don’t trade for Kawhi unless you think he’s that missing piece that’s going to put you over the edge? Boston? Maybe?!

abippityboop | Knicks

16 | 5 hours ago

I’d hate to see him on Detroit next year. Not sure what assets they have to trade or what his cost would even be. But having to deal with him and Cade on the floor at the same time would be rough.

Skank_hunt42 | Thunder

8 | 5 hours ago

Damn, I didn’t even think about the Pistons. They have the money to do it, too via their expiring contracts.

stayfrosty | Warriors

6 | 5 hours ago

Dont worry. They would never be on the floor together.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

2 | an hour ago

I think Detroit makes the most sense, but 0 shot Kawhi wants to extend there.

IMO it’ll be GSW, Rockets, and Miami as the teams making actual offers for Kawhi, but I have a feeling they’ll be low offers and LAC won’t budge.

StrawberryItten | Spurs

4 | 5 hours ago

Boston, Denver but they don’t have a lot to trade, depending on this round maybe the Pistons. Maybe the Wolves take a gamble and try to get Kawhi for Randle? they’d have to attach a few pics I think and even then Salary matching would suck tho and even then most of their picks rn are swaps…

Man, the market is a bit weird. I think for the most part teams are ‘set’ barring some swinging at the fences

T-Macch | Trail Blazers

6 | 5 hours ago

If I’m Wolves I’d beg Lebron for a ring chasing season in Minnesota

SilkySmoothTesticles

1 | 4 hours ago

They would win it all. Imagine Ant with daily guidance and support from LeBron. Look at what a couple seasons with him did for Reaves.

T-Macch | Trail Blazers

1 | 3 hours ago

Imagine replacing Julius Randle with Lebron James. Hell imagine playing bully ball with Gobert, Naz Reid, Randle, Lebron and Ant.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | an hour ago

There is absolutely no shot LeBron ends his career in a place that isn’t a storybook ending.

A-Centrifugal-Force

5 | 5 hours ago

Golden state still has most of their picks. Could also throw in Podz if the Clippers want him.

A lineup of Steph, Kawhi, Jimmy, Draymond, and Horford would truly be Olden State

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | an hour ago

Either Jimmy or Dray has to be included just for salary matching purposes for Kawhi.

SilkySmoothTesticles

2 | 4 hours ago

That’s a very huge gamble with the history of injuries.

journieburner

1 | 3 hours ago

I don’t get teams trading for old Harden (who is still good), but not trading for old Kawhi (who is arguably better) even with their whole money laundering scheme

510Kyle

3 | 5 hours ago

Sure, who’s offering?

ReignOnWillie | NBA

3 | 4 hours ago

Bro just throw in Leonard and five 2nd round picks and hit Suggest Trade

510Kyle

2 | 4 hours ago

Ppl love acting like miracle trades are just waiting to happen, there’s a reason they don’t lol

Ok-Tree4365

2 | 4 hours ago

They have a lot of flexibility at the moment. Garland, Collins, Mathurin, Sanders, Niederhauser, Miller, DJJ, and Jackson are all between 22-28 years old, and would start or be in the rotation on most teams in the league. Then you have 2 or 3 picks coming in from this year’s draft, and over 30 guys like Kawhi, Dunn and Beal.

I don’t think it would be wise to make a major trade in the offseason - wait and see how this young core plays in the first half of the season.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 38 minutes ago

I mean, they absolutely need to re-tool and polish some things up assuming they get another guard with pick #5.

Mathurin, Sanders, and Miller are all SGs who don’t really have any facilitating chops to be a PG (or really even a good secondary playmaker), nor do they easily slot up to the SF position. We then are getting Beal back, who presumably will earn some minutes because he’s a better secondary playmaker + 3 point shooter.

I’ve been saying this for a while, but LAC is likely going to have to move 1 of those SGs, and this fully assumes they basically cut Cam Christie who has shown some amount of flashes.

osj777 | Thunder

2 | 3 hours ago

He fought so hard to get to LA I could see him retiring if he’s traded

SilkySmoothTesticles

1 | 4 hours ago

Nobody is taking Kawhi.

Why signup for a Watson level bad deal with the new tanking rules?

I hope Kawhi gets the treatment CP3 did when he has to retire a Clipper

highscoring | Huskies

134 | 6 hours ago

I can’t believe they’re still not penalized and somehow still have this pick knowing what we know, what a sham of a league

YujiDomainExpansion

56 | 5 hours ago

Counterpoint: The league taking away this 5th overall pick would go against the precedents set by the league. The Clippers would’ve never traded Ivica Zubac in the first place if they knew the league could confiscate this pick.

If they take away future picks owned by the Clippers, fine. If they void Kawhi Leonard, fine. But to do all of that AND take away the 5th overall pick? The league would essentially be taking away Ivica Zubac from the Clippers who had nothing to do with the scandal. They didn’t even dish out this level of harsh punishment to the Timberwolves. In fact, they gave the Timberwolves two of their five first-round picks back and none of the picks taken away were acquired by trading a player away.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

45 | 5 hours ago

Yep. There’s a lot of sensible punishments, but stripping them of draft capital that they attained in another deal would be stupid.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

-7 | 5 hours ago

I don’t understand. Draft capital is a still draft capital. Are we going to separate draft picks earned from draft picks traded for? If someone commits fraud and owes another company 5 million dollars, do you only collect that 5 million from money made a very specific way? “No. You can’t have that 5 million, I sold my horse for that 5 million”.

naaahhman | Trail Blazers

2 | 5 hours ago

You forgot the part that the people punishing Ballmer can also get punished. So, they wouldn’t want their draft assets taken like that. Ergo, that punishment isn’t in the CBA. Hell, the max fine is $10M, that’s coin tray money to Ballmer. Long story short, the NBA owners protected themselves from excessive punishments.

FredMcGriff493 | Celtics

1 | 4 hours ago

Future draft picks represent liquidity the same way cash does but as soon as the draft order is set they become an actual asset. In the scenario you described would it make any sense for the company that got defrauded to receive a piece of equipment that cost $5 million instead of actual money from the company that defrauded them?

dearth_karmic | Warriors

0 | 4 hours ago

but as soon as the draft order is set they become an actual asset.

But why would the draft order matter? It’s based on the team it originally came from.

FredMcGriff493 | Celtics

2 | 3 hours ago

Honestly I don’t really know, I was just trying to quickly explain why the analogy you gave in your previous was a terrible comparison. Like if the goal of the league is to penalize the Clippers for defrauding all 29 other teams with the Kawhi Leaonard thing, why would they erase the Pacers 2026 draft pick from existence? Unless the Clippers directly defrauded the Pacers and only the Pacers in their dealings for that pick, it makes zero sense to take away the specific draft capital acquired completely independent of Kawhi Leonard when the league could just as easily strip them of their own picks that are allotted as part of the normal draft process.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

1 | 2 hours ago

why would they erase the Pacers 2026 draft pick from existence?

I don’t see the difference. It’s just an asset. They’re NOT punishing the Pacers. They still get Zubac. Why does it matter which pick is taken from the Clippers?

FredMcGriff493 | Celtics

1 | an hour ago

Then you’re a moron. Would it make any sense to just remove Zubac (or any other player) from the roster instead as punishment for the Leonard thing if they hadn’t made that trade? This would be like knocking down a Morgan Stanley wealth management satellite office in Omaha as a penalty for their role in the 2008 financial crisis instead of fining them an exorbitant sum of money and banning them from trading collateralized mortgage backed securities.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

1 | 40 minutes ago

The penalty is taking away picks. It shouldn’t matter where the pick came from.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 3 hours ago

The NBA allowed them to make this Zubac trade. If you strip them of what they got in that transaction, then LAC would have obviously just kept Zubac to begin with as at least they have their player. If you can’t punish Zubac or LAC’s ability to have Zubac, why would they then be allowed to punish LAC’s ability to have assets from Zubac?

Trying to equate it to any other situation is stupid because these are very different situations.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

0 | 3 hours ago

The NBA allowed them to make this Zubac trade.

So a team under investigation shouldn’t be able to make trades?

If you strip them of what they got in that transaction, then LAC would have obviously just kept Zubac to begin with as at least they have their player.

And they would have then lost another pick. If Zubac’s value was the pick, what difference does it make? The Clippers would still be down that pick instead of this one.

What you’re suggesting is that if a team is going to circumvent the salary cap, they should immediately trade all their picks so they can’t get any of them taken away.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 3 hours ago

So a team under investigation shouldn’t be able to make trades?

If you strip LAC of assets they got from Zubac, you are effectively signaling this to be the case. And if this is the case, then make this clear to them or make it a rule. If this isn’t the case, then yeah, don’t strip the picks as I mentioned.

And they would have then lost another pick. If Zubac’s value was the pick, what difference does it make?

… the difference is that one pick was acquired from a separate transaction and the other is the inherent pick that is theirs?

What you’re suggesting is that if a team is going to circumvent the salary cap, they should immediately trade all their picks so they can’t get any of them taken away.

Except we have no idea what the punishment is. If a team wants to, in fear of punishment, trade ALL their assets away, then go for it. Then if the punishment came in differently or less than expected, guess what, you then shot yourself in the foot.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

1 | 2 hours ago

But what you’re suggesting is that it’s bad to punish a team that’s in a different place from where they were when they committed the infraction. Or when the investigation started. That’s strange. Although, that’s also why I’ve been arguing this should have happened in weeks. Not months or a year. If you’re going to null Kawhi’s contract, you just gave him another free season of play and pay.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 2 hours ago

You can argue for swiftness all you want. Investigations, even in relatively obvious cases, take an immense amount of time. There’s many reasons to not rush an investigation, and you wanting faster results isn’t something that can just be done if you want to handle significant situations and infractions responsibly.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

1 | an hour ago

I get that. But they also become pointless at some point. Like when Kawhi is a free agent or when the former president of the united states gets re-elected and all his crimes magically vanish.

spin8x | Timberwolves

15 | 5 hours ago

There’s no reason the NBA should base their punishment off of whatever decision the Clippers may or may not have made. The major injustice is circumventing the salary cap in the first place.

AntiAntiDentite7

15 | 5 hours ago

There’s no reason the NBA should base the punishment off the hopes and dreams of random redditors either

YujiDomainExpansion

5 | 5 hours ago

Even during the Joe Smith stuff, the NBA didn’t randomly go and void the contracts of players on the Timberwolves which is what you’re asking the league to do here by taking away the pick awarded by trading Ivica Zubac. Should they void Bennedict Mathurin as well? How about Isaiah Jackson? No? Why is that? Because they weren’t involved in the scandal? Well, neither was Zubac.

The league didn’t even take away picks from the Timberwolves that they acquired via trade either. That is the precedent we’ve seen. In fact, we’ve seen the NBA be lenient and restore their 2003 and 2005 first-round picks after the fact.

spin8x | Timberwolves

1 | 5 hours ago

Taking away an owned picked is wildly different than voiding the contract of a random player. Zubac is not getting meaningfully impacted, nor is the matching salary in that trade. As with the Joe Smith punishment, the only contract that by precedent could be voided is Kawhii.

As for the precedent of only taking away only originally owned picks, it’s not exactly common for teams to be carrying surplus picks, I doubt the NBA really cares how they’re acquired. In fact, allowing the Clippers to keep picks acquired while they’re under investigation that they are aware may strip picks creates a potential conflict of interest where team would seek to shed their own picks in favor of other picks that are now theoretically untouchable by the league.

This scenario isn’t quite that, because it was player for picks, but teams could still look to shed high value players for more valuable picks than their own in advance of a theoretical punishment.

Not saying any of these even come to pass, just that I disagree with your framing of the hypothetical punishment of taking away 5.

[deleted]

-2 | 4 hours ago

[deleted]

spin8x | Timberwolves

3 | 4 hours ago

To answer all of your questions, it would be to punish the Clippers with an asset they currently have.

Why would Silver need to void any of the other transactions? As you said, they’re completely separate transactions, he’s not going to punish the Pacers, or Zubac, or anyone else. The parties in line to be punished are the Clippers/Ballmer and Kawhii Leonard. I still don’t understand your argument that taking the 5th pick, even if I don’t think it will happen, would punish anyone else other than the Clippers organization.

And no clue what your DoJ point is supposed to be, they are pursuing charges for the individuals that committed fraud and the company has filed for bankruptcy. What exactly do you propose the equivalent of that would be in the NBA? Does Aspiration have assets equivalent to CBA-designated draft picks versus assets that they acquired through other means? Maybe bankruptcy law makes that more clear, I don’t know.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

-1 | 5 hours ago

I don’t understand. Draft capital is a still draft capital. Are we going to separate draft picks earned from draft picks traded for? If someone commits fraud and owes another company 5 million dollars, do you only collect that 5 million from money made a very specific way? “No. You can’t have that 5 million, I sold my horse for that 5 million”.

lurkingtonbear

-9 | 5 hours ago

Who cares what they would or would’ve done? Fuck them. They circumvented the salary cap. They’re lucky they even get to be a team at all still, let alone have a pick. Take the pick and ban Kawhi for life. This shit was so easy and they’ve fumbled it so fucking hard. Get it together NBA.

Impossible_Onion_975

12 | 5 hours ago

channel this energy into getting a job

AntiAntiDentite7

8 | 5 hours ago

Lmao. Some of you need a friend

StrikeFeeling6629

2 | 4 hours ago

“Lucky they even get to be a team” you people are so fucking dramatic lmaooooo

AshenSacrifice | Clippers

2 | 4 hours ago

“Luck” lol read the room 🤣🤣

Impossible_Onion_975

6 | 5 hours ago

over a move completely separate to the scandal. god you people are fucking crybabies

c32dot | Lakers

-7 | 5 hours ago

Cheating is fine I guess…

AshenSacrifice | Clippers

2 | 4 hours ago

Getting PPE loans was fine too

FredMcGriff493 | Celtics

5 | 4 hours ago

This pick isn’t even their own; how would confiscating it work? Should the league just ban all 29 other teams from trading picks to them until they figure out a punishment?

RickySuela

-3 | 4 hours ago

I imagine it would work like this: the Clippers wouldn’t get to use the pick and it would just go from the 4th pick in the draft to the 6th pick with the Clippers not being allowed to draft anyone.

AshenSacrifice | Clippers

3 | 4 hours ago

Maybe you don’t know as much as you think you do

berfels | Pacers

3 | 5 hours ago

I truly cannot fathom why it wouldn’t be a good move to circumvent the cap if you’re a win now team. At the LEAST it’ll take a year for the investigation and odds are they’re about to set a precedent that really nothing is going to happen.

BatterMyHeart

2 | 6 hours ago

Its fuckin embarrassing

TheZacef | Timberwolves

-1 | 5 hours ago

It’s because they did it for just Leonard, not like they did it for a league powerhouse like Joe Smith. That’d be really heinous.

thepenguin12

-4 | 3 hours ago

Omg thank you. The rich never get fucked and this is a perfect example of many situations that blow my mind. They are all turds

dearth_karmic | Warriors

-6 | 5 hours ago

They should take away their pick DURING the draft.

BrotherSeamus | Thunder

-3 | 4 hours ago

Acuff or Wagler or Mara or whoever comes out on stage and deputy commissioner Mark Tatum pulls out a Clippers hat. But instead of placing it on the players head, he whips it onto the floor. Welcome to Indiana, son.

dearth_karmic | Warriors

-1 | 4 hours ago

Love it!!!

Asleep_Ground1710 | Bulls

104 | 6 hours ago

Lowkey curious to see who they pick between Wagler/Acuff mainly(ofc Brown Jr, Flemmings also options).

I dont expect Garland to be in their future plans, and wouldnt be surprised if he got traded eventually to one of the Rockets/Magic/Wolves

totallytuatara

31 | 6 hours ago

I actually really like that for those teams you mentioned

MMAjunkie504 | Pelicans

5 | 2 hours ago

All 3 would benefit from a solid PG addition, agreed

YujiDomainExpansion

21 | 6 hours ago

Article makes the case for Acuff Jr.:

> Garland is the franchise point guard and in his prime, but the Clippers have ended each of the last two seasons without a true backup, which matters with Garland’s durability concerns.

> Wagler is particularly intriguing as a big guard who could potentially fit next to Garland in the short term as a backup and in the long term as a shooting guard. Wagler has concerning physical traits as far as strength and athleticism, and he doesn’t profile as an impact defender.

Seems like the idea would be to bring Acuff Jr. in as a backup for a year before handing him the keys?

12footjumpshot

45 | 5 hours ago

An Acuff/Garland back court is BBQ chicken on defense but if you believe he can be a better lead guard than Garland then you draft him and trade Garland away later I guess.

AntiAntiDentite7

2 | 34 minutes ago

People shit on Acuffs because he’s short and is a defensive liability, but Brunson has been leading NY to wins just fine.

12footjumpshot

1 | 26 minutes ago

yes but you couldn’t pair Brunson with Garland or Acuff and survive a playoff series is my point.

Rich_Ad_4886 | Knicks

1 | 18 minutes ago

Acuff is genuinely among the worst college defenders ever I’m not even kidding. His defensive stats in college are worse than Brunson’s, worse than IT’s (5’9 btw), even worse than Trae’s.

You know which player he has comparable analytics to? Jimmer Fredette.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 31 minutes ago

Right, this is a clear BPA situation. It might be different if there was a clearcut talented wing in their range, but the top prospects outside of Top 4 are basically all guards.

If they decide Wagler is BPA, then take him. But if you’re picking him simply because he fits next to Garland, then that’s silly.

Diamond4Hands4Ever | Warriors

26 | 5 hours ago

Wagler has concerning physical traits as far as strength and athleticism, and he doesn’t profile as an impact defender.

Very interesting they mention Wagler doesn’t profile to be an impactful defender when the other guy in consideration is arguably (and this is not an exaggeration) the worst defensive prospect this century.

If you are an analytics guy, Acuff was around the 2500th ranked defender in college basketball this season according to the metrics. If you are an eye test guy, just watch any game he played in (like the recent post in the draft sub, but there’s other games too).

Now it just happens he’s one of the best offensive freshman point guards in the history of college basketball too, but the issue is his offense/defense value doesn’t work with Garland as you can’t win with both of them. So it doesn’t really make sense to pick Acuff unless you plan on moving Garland but if you do, Acuff won’t be ready to help the Clippers contend either. So either way, he doesn’t make much sense at all.

StrikeFeeling6629

4 | 4 hours ago

I think the case for Acuff is that if he’s the best player available and a future cornerstone, you take him regardless of Garland’s future. I don’t see that front office basing the pick off of the fit with Garland, and assume this will be more of a reset going into the 2027 offseason. If they draft for fit, seems like Burries is the best bet because Wagler is going to have similar concerns on the defensive end. I would be concerned about his frame with NBA physicality

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

15 | 5 hours ago

I’ve been curious what those teams could even offer for Garland. I don’t think he has immensely high value, but I don’t think they’re just giving him away for whatever filler they can get either.

WeBelieveIn4 | Raptors

17 | 5 hours ago

I dont expect Garland to be in their future plans,

Why not? He’s only 26 and a 2-time all star. Guy has gotten so underrated on this sub.

YujiDomainExpansion

4 | 5 hours ago

Likely because, if the Clippers trade Leonard, the next time they’re ready to be a legitimate contender again, Garland will be 30.

HawaiianOrganDonor | Pelicans

1 | 3 hours ago

The Clippers don’t have their own first round pick until 2030 though. It would make no sense to start a rebuild now.

Jimmy0034 | Clippers

3 | 3 hours ago

It is not a rebuild, it is retool to remain competitive. Not every trade has to be for picks, it could just be players that clippers need more. Garland is also free agent in 2028 which he is going probably ask for a lot of money and considering the health issue, it could be stalemate.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 29 minutes ago

I also don’t think it’s crazy to just want to trade Garland, who they clearly got opportunistically.

Harden wanted money, we didn’t want to pay him. He then wanted to go to a potential contender, Cleveland was a fit, and the numbers happened to work out perfectly.

I’m actually still high on Garland, but if there’s a team out there willing to make a good deal for him, then it clears up a lot of LAC’s headaches assuming they want Acuff.

mucho-gusto | CLE

3 | 4 hours ago

If his foot is permanently crocked yeah it’s risky. Otherwise I think he can get back to his peak. They would know having him around by now

Ok-Name-5504

2 | 3 hours ago

Because he’s bad defensively and he’s not shown himself to be a good enough ball handler/scorer to handle the increased intensity of playoff defense.

[deleted]

0 | 5 hours ago

[deleted]

RageOnGoneDo | BOS

4 | 5 hours ago

This is revisionist history. People might not have liked those post KD big-3 teams but by most regular season metrics that we dub teams contenders they were contenders. Especially the second season when Melo was gone.

nolimitnolimits

3 | 5 hours ago

Why would 26 year old Garland not be in their plans…he had a great end to the season and immediately fit in well

Rough_Bobcat5293 | Cavaliers

0 | 4 hours ago

Like those ideas, but I wonder if Ballmer can be convinced to do a rebuild.

RudyGobertFMVP | Timberwolves

67 | 6 hours ago

Building aspirations around the young draft potential

Atl-Fan_FTS | Hawks

38 | 6 hours ago

Planting the seeds for future success!

PeacePuzzleheaded124

42 | 6 hours ago

who are they “eyeing” at that spot

likwitsnake | Supersonics

31 | 6 hours ago

Some guy named Smoke Screen apparently

Schwalm | Suns

5 | 5 hours ago

That’s a move

mucho-gusto | CLE

5 | 4 hours ago

Unironically a sick nickname for a player. Like he just appears instantaneously blocking your man. Maybe even in a great Lin Kuei outfit

Spiritual-Bobcat5635

1 | an hour ago

Cash considerations

Zestyclose-Rabbit17

16 | 6 hours ago

If they win at the same pace they did the 2nd half of the season, they would be a top 6 seed.

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

12 | 5 hours ago

I don’t believe for a second we’ll see a second season with this level of health from Kawhi.

Zestyclose-Rabbit17

3 | 4 hours ago

I think 75% of last year’s health might be enough, with continued development of Mathurin, Yannick, 5th pick, etc. They have talent, especially if they use their pick wisely.

Edit: the season ending injury to Yannick and later, to Isaiah Jackson really hurt them at the end.

typezeroxx | Clippers

1 | 41 minutes ago

Sell high

Immediate_Wonder_630

10 | 6 hours ago

Acuff is going to be an all star in LA

Revenesis | Knicks

10 | 6 hours ago

No reason for any information to leak out now. Wait until draft night and see what happens. What if someone in the top 4 is scared of Wilson’s bust potential or wants to take a bigger swing with a guy like Wagler, letting Boozer fall to 5?

Also if a team like Sacramento is desperate to draft Acuff they can give up pick 7 and more assets on draft night, while the Clippers can still get the player they wanted all along

jon__koa | Knicks

4 | 5 hours ago

Now is absolutely the time to gauge the market, see what teams are thinking, and pick a few guys to look at just in case wacky things happen

InTheMorning_Nightss | San Diego Clippers

1 | 28 minutes ago

I imagine that LAC is going to talk to basically like every player in the 1-10 range. They already spoke to Dybansta, and I’m sure they’ll talk to Boozer, Wilson, DP, Acuff, Wagler, Mikel, etc.

ottespana | Thunder

6 | 6 hours ago

Im glad they managed to catch on to this draft being important and talented, big move from the FO

KumingaCarnage | Warriors

4 | 4 hours ago

Clippers give us Kawhi, the Kawhi era in LA is over.

Take butlers expiring off our hands and our 11th pick in the draft and next years first rounder.

bzl33

1 | 5 hours ago

the scam they ran on Indiana was hilarious

WeBelieveIn4 | Raptors

1 | 5 hours ago

Indiana scammed themselves

bzl33

-1 | 5 hours ago

They got greedy instead of staying the course

jon__koa | Knicks

7 | 5 hours ago

They gambled and lost their bet

LarBrd33

2 | 5 hours ago

Has a chance to go down as one of the best trades in franchise history. Veteran non-star center for Mathurin, 5th pick and a future unprotected 1st. Insane.

I_AM_DEATH-INCARNATE

2 | 5 hours ago

I like the stock

Puzzleheaded_King19

1 | 5 hours ago

Am I the only one who loves Evans from duke

Puzzleheaded_King19

3 | 5 hours ago

Not for the 5th pick obvi

Turk1518 | Thunder

1 | 5 hours ago

Thunder gives them #12, #17, and the Clippers back their 2026-27 pick for #5?

Skank_hunt42 | Thunder

1 | 5 hours ago

Who would you want at 5 that the Thunder couldn’t get at 12?

Turk1518 | Thunder

2 | 5 hours ago

It’s such a guard heavy area that I’m not sure if there’s anyone that we desperately need that we know could get playing time next year.

I would almost rather just trade up to 8-9 to ensure we get our pick of forwards.

Skank_hunt42 | Thunder

3 | 5 hours ago

I know most want Yaxel, but after seeing Quaintance’s measureables from the combine….I’d bet Presti is salivating.

I want to continue the tradition of drafting injured players with upside. Quaintance at 12 works for me and then maybe Cenac or Stienbach at 17. No need to trade up to get what we need IMO.

New_Essay_4869 | Thunder

1 | 5 hours ago

Keaton Wagler, you are a Clipper

Turk1518 | Thunder

1 | 5 hours ago

His wingspan was horrible. Insane talent but I was shocked at how limited his length was.

New_Essay_4869 | Thunder

2 | 5 hours ago

I wouldnt say horrible as it was still a +1 but yeah people thought it would be longer based on how skinny he looks. I believe he will end up as the best player form this class years down the road

fineseries81

1 | 5 hours ago

Garland, Mathurin, pick 5, and whatever they can get for Kawhi isn’t a terrible start to a rebuild.

pendletonskyforce | Kings

1 | 5 hours ago

It’s still wild that they got the 5th pick.

mattr1198 | Knicks

1 | 4 hours ago

Lawrence Frank is on a redemption path with everything he’s done in 2026. Finally realized it’s time to kick the rebuild off and get younger. I wouldn’t be surprised if they sell Kawhi high given he played debatably his best basketball since the 2019 Raptors season this past season.

jgroove_LA

1 | 4 hours ago

oh we think someone is dropping

Friendly-Profit-8590

1 | 4 hours ago

Trade Kawhi for whatever you can get and start over

TXtogo

1 | 4 hours ago

They’re gonna try to move Kawhi ain’t they

judah249 | Suns

1 | 3 hours ago

Clippers not wanting a retirement home squad?!

Gamerxx13

1 | 3 hours ago

clippers need younger players . they are rebuilding whether they like it or not

figureour | Wizards

1 | 3 hours ago

The contracts were lined up so that this next season was meant to be their last with this group anyways, wasn’t it? And then rebuild eventually once they had the picks for it? It would be madness to trade away what should be a great prospect.

godfrey1 | LAL

1 | 3 hours ago

Clippers having a draft pick is a joke lol

IndyPoker979 | Pacers

1 | 3 hours ago

When do we get to find out the results of the aspiration investigation? I love how it’s been tried to be forgotten.

KUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUZ | Lakers

1 | 3 hours ago

So no punishment for aspiration? Silver the clown going to sweep it under the rug while swallowing Ballmers staff?

OTGbling

1 | 2 hours ago

How about the NBA finally gives them a punishment for the KL2 drama and takes their damn pick

Fuckthebeard

1 | an hour ago

Shouldn’t the pick be taken away?

Ayo_Trill

0 | 6 hours ago

Thank you! Don’t put no more stock into this Kawhi era.

logicalconflict | Jazz

0 | 4 hours ago

The Clips are excited about it? Gee thanks, I suddenly feel terrible about this draft.

dkdoki | Clippers

0 | 3 hours ago

This off season is going to be huge for the team. Trade kawhi, maybe trade down and even trading DG should be on the table depending what kind of offers are out there. Pivotal summer. Go cook Frank

Asleep-Use-7336

0 | 6 hours ago

keeping the pick is the right move. their window with this core is closing so they need to start injecting young talent like wagler who fits next to harden

roydonkofficial

8 | 6 hours ago

Fits next to who?

theRestisConfettii | Nets

3 | 4 hours ago

You may want to check the Clippers roster, cuh

Carlinjamesgk

-1 | 5 hours ago

Aka goodbye kawhi

With kawhi I feel like if he’s not open to playing anywhere else he’s going to be tough to trade. Could honestly see him just retiring

TXtogo

1 | 4 hours ago

The lakers could take him, I don’t know about golden state, seems like they want to make a run. There are teams that would like Kawhi, the upside is that he’s 35 but he has very low miles.

Carlinjamesgk

1 | 2 hours ago

Yeah I agree.

motorboat_mcgee | Lakers

-4 | 5 hours ago

Wild that they are going to retool pretty easily once they trade away Kawhi and company, and not see any sort of real penalty considering the under the table payoffs

adampq | Clippers

4 | 4 hours ago

Only one LA team gets to retool pretty easily, okay?

motorboat_mcgee | Lakers

-1 | 4 hours ago

I think you’re missing some important context about my complaint

adampq | Clippers

5 | 4 hours ago

I think you’re missing some important subtext about mine

CrossDeSolo

-6 | 6 hours ago

Trade kawhii to the wizards for the #1 pick and draft twice if you like the draft

knownonou | Clippers

11 | 6 hours ago

Why would the wizards do that

[Murray] The LA Clippers “like this draft” and are eager to keep their No. 5 pick instead of using it in a trade for a veteran.