[Highlight] The Jazz defense being physical with Nikola Jokic, preventing him from moving off the ball, and Jokic is eventually called for the offensive foul (4th foul). With replays. Jazz and Nuggets commentaries
They’ve been getting away with a lot (and I mean a lot) guarding him but I’m surprised that wasn’t a tech/flagrant
They’ve been letting them play. Utah’s been very physical in defending him but they’ve also allowed him to just lay down on guys all night as well without calling it.
Physical and fouling are 2 different things. You can’t put yours arms around his legs like that in this video
and show me where you are allowed to lay down on top of guys boxing you out…. The physicality has been going on all night with whistles being held on both sides. Also Jokic has still been able to flop enough to get his calls or do you really believe Harkless bumping him can really push him back 5 ft.?
If you watch the video, George is also wrapping both arms around his legs which is a foul. 🤷
so, non calls on both sides? glad to see we agree but somehow you don’t think we do?
wtf are you talking about man?
I really don’t know how to respond to that? Original comment was that Utah’s been getting away with a lot and i countered with the argument that both teams have and the refs have let them both play very physical.
I then used the example of boxing out and you countered with them holding. Both examples of being physical and refs holding their whistles.
Utah has been fouling and the refs haven’t been calling it. Is that easy enough for you to understand?
Would love to understand your logic when Denver has shot 20 FT’s in the fourth vs Utah shooting 3…. Kinda of disproves your statement a little no?
33 vs 26 for the night BTW…
Dude you are insanely dense lol
You seem to be focusing on this clip, while they are referencing other clips posted on /r/nba (and just from watching the game, I’d guess)
You both seem to be of the opinion that fouling is occurring, but if the refs are letting it slide for both sides, it seems like a non-issue for the most part.
Jokic has 5 fouls. They have been calling it one way
Just in regard to Jokic or for all players? It looks like three Jazz players also have 5 fouls. Also, someone posted a link to all of Jokic’s fouls, and none of them are the ones the other poster is talking to you about (laying on a guy’s back).
They’ve been calling it one way is actually insane homerism lmao, he hooked and tackled Filipowski and he’s the one who got to shoot FT’s for it in a 1 point game late in the 4th
You’re arguing with Jokic stans my guy. The only player who’s ever been wronged is Jokic, suggesting otherwise is incompressible to them.
Apparently, I actually like jokic for the most part and believe he tends to get hacked a lot. So I understand some of the flopping if that’s what he needs to get calls at this point. But man finding fans who can be reasonable and realistic with their own guys.
George keeps backing up further and further under him. Watch the clip. Jokic isn’t moving. That’s what causes these things is little guys try to undercut him, and it’s the reason the ref standing right there watching it didn’t call anything, not to mention George was grabbing him by the legs to keep him from getting around.
Your little guard tried to lock arms and lock his arm around jokers leg to keep grinding on him like it’s his hs prom to keep him from getting the board.
James Harden lol
lololol
You really are a peabrain
you seem upset and unable to hold a civil conversation.
okay i know its the anti jokic circlejerk event this week on this sub, but the way theyre holding him this game is absurd, i mean at some point you gotta get frustrated how nothing is called when opponent has his both hands wrapped around you
he has 4 free throws today. Kyle Filipowski has 9 on touch fouls. Even the Keyonte George foul for which Jokic should have gotten a flagrant 1 foul for, should have been a foul call the other way around way before that
Refs saw this and said ‘lemme make up for that real quick’
That’s exactly what happened
All the nba subs will do the same thing where one week everyone loves a guy, and the next when they do something bad, everyone turns on them and act like their entire career is the same. Right now people are talking nicely about luka, after everyone dragged his name through the mud and then some. Also if theres a single play that shows shai flopped a bit, everyone brings their pitch forks to talk about how hes a talentless bum that can only score because everyones afraid to touch him in case shai flops.
That’s a goomba fallacy. People aren’t turning on a player, it’s just that there’s millions of people on the sub, and different ones are vocal at different times. When a star has a particularly bad game, the haters will come out of the woodwork and flood the sub with posts and comments ragging on the player. When a star has a great game, their fans will come out instead and praise the player while the haters have no material to work with.
I would care more about defenders being handsy with him if he didn’t grab, pull, and or shove everything he tries to get position or go for a rebound.
To be clear, I don’t give a shit about that stuff. Let them be physical. Post play has been physical for the 30 years I’ve been watching ball. But let’s not talk about physical D on Jokic while disregarding how physical he is himself.
Jokic is massive. There’s naturally always gonna be physical play between centers. He dominates centers.
Teams are sending smaller players to literally foul him intentionally. Jokic gains nothing from this. It’s not like he’s gonna be allowed to do more to the little guys or the centers.
This is quite literally the best strategy against Jokic. It decides games. Either the refs call the fouls and Jokic plays his game. Or refs don’t call the fouls and he’s tuzzling all game with little guys.. Which is a huge bonus for the other team because small dudes just get away with much more and drain way more stamina from Jokic than centers do.
Sometimes it becomes a free win because refs be calling Jokic for fouls on the little guys just cause they little as hell.
It’s the weirdest thing. I don’t remember any other center having small dudes just freely grab them all game long and no whistle. It’s such a massive advantage.
I wonder if teams could start having “muggsy bogues” kinda dudes on their team. Really small dudes that would just grab Shai/Ant size guys all game long freely. People severely underestimate the value of little dudes that are allowed to defend with no rules.
This definitely seems to be an effective strategy against Jokic, and I think the Nugs/Thunder series is the first time it was clearly effective. If Jokic is too slow to beat defenders to his spots but tries to get there anyway, I don’t see how the defender can do anything about that other than get physical and deny Jokic an advantageous position in the space they are holding. My only guess as to why everyone doesn’t do this against the Nuggets is it looks incredibly taxing. Bailey is fighting for his life to not yield ground there.
Actually think it has become a staple of this game, where bigs get absolutely mauled by smaller players and get no call. That’s one of the few reasons why only a few offenses feed the post.
Also I get annoyed with the “undersized pg are liabilities.” Yes they have limitations, but with great positioning and iq you can avoid switches and cut off angles. You can post up and shoot over smaller defenders, but its hard dribbling against a quicker person closer to the ground.
Smaller defenders have always been able to get away with a lot more physicality against post players, at least in the last 40 years or so. But if someone had tried that strategy and front Shaq with a smaller player, Shaq would score 75 points. Jokic’s natural inclination (and it’s what I love about his game) is to function as a facilitator and hub for the rest of the offense, not a back to the basket scorer. I’m not sure if jokic is unwilling to exploit his mismatch, or if there’s some other limitation… the obvious meme would be that his lack of explosive athleticism makes him easier to deny on entry passes, but the way he rebounds I’d have a hard time thinking he couldn’t go up and win that battle against keyonte George pretty consistently.
Yeah. The defenders are playing super physical, but so is he. Both players have both hands on the other guy. Pretty much every moment up to the actual foul call, Jokic is hooking his defender. There’s ten moments here an official could blow the whistle and be right.
I would say the hooking crosses a line. A dude pushes or grabs a bit? Whatever. It’s a contact sport. Hooking is a bitch move.
Yeah this kind of context is missed a lot when people just try to claim that Jokic is being fouled a lot. It depends how the game is being called, and either way it doesn’t excuse Jokic from losing his cool like he does here
I think everyone is fine with this in the post. But this is 30ft from the basket. That’s never really been allowed before and it’s startling to see it kinda just flip
He gets away with so much physicality that goes uncalled and when defenses return the favor it’s seen as an injustice. People get mad when defenders front the post against him, it’s insane. Glad people are pointing out it goes both ways.
Yeah well he’s sitting on people so it’s cool
This what I don’t get. Jokic definitely flops and can do some sneaky things, but refs all allowing him to be mauled every game. It’s a lose-lose situation
He embellishes contact because he doesn’t get shit called for him. I’ve watched probably half of the games Jokic has played in since being drafted and he always embellishes physicality when he recognizes he’s not getting calls. Look at OKC in the playoffs last year. Those mugs were literally wrestling him most of the series and he still averaged 28/14/6 lol
THANK YOU. I don’t know how many times I’ve tried to say this, and it is so nice to see someone else say it first. He’s always been mauled and flops to remind everyone how mauled he’s getting. Although it sucks when he starts overdoing it when he’s frustrated.
It’s serbian “inat” at work
inat just means spite in serbian, only in Serbia it’s not seen negatively.
It’s not just spite which is why I wrote it like that
He gets the same non-whistle as Curry, he just flops to get the calls while Curry just accepts it. It’s like refs feel like, if you’re a generational player, you need to be good enough to succeed despite never getting calls.
He also shoves and body checks people constantly off ball and in the paint without getting called for it, those plays never get posted and people just ignore it. It’s just when defenders return the favor for some reason those plays get posted on here and people pay attention to it more, then it’s “defenders are allowed to get away with anything while guarding Jokic, it’s not fair”
It’s both ways. OKC have multiple players body checking and mauling in the paint, so are you one to complain?
… they’re fouling the shit out of him.
Happens all the time yet he doesn’t get called for shit mate. Can’t blame him for selling contact from time to time
They just straight up wrestling lmao
When you are a smaller player you are allowed to do anything to the bigger player. That’s the rule. hat has been the tactcs against Jokic and KAT for years. Now people do it to wemby too. 4 free throws for Jokic this game btw
Kinda crazy that refs still don’t know how to officiate small vs big matchups.
They just don’t care to
The funny thing is if the defender was guarding him face up those would be blocking fouls. But because they have their back to him they’re allowed to just slide in front of him and grab with impunity.
I mean I see this happen to every post player when they’re running down the court to try and establish position
NBA never calls blocking fouls off ball
I mean it’s rare that teams actually commit blocking fouls off ball which is why they don’t get called. Most of the time they’re “blocked” it’s just a moving screen.
What’s happening in the clip isn’t specific to Jokic, but he’s especially susceptible to it cause he’s slow.
Watch a spurs game. Wemby practises sumo every time he tries to establish a post position lmao
But yeah it’s just a thing and more teams will do it against Jokic now
Jokic has thrown his 300lbs of blubber on 2 guys almost ending their seasons with knee injuries so I think it balances out
your flair makes it illegal for you to speak about “ending their seasons with knee injuries” type of plays.
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Sounds like an ad hominem.
Soft
Nobody’s gonna forget that Lu Dort is a dirty player, give up on the damage control already.
Nobody pays attention to thunder fans…lol
Jokic picked up 4 fouls in ~6 minutes in the 3rd quarter:
FYI for anyone else the first 3 are just him being a bad defender by the rim
Idk what’s worse your big man not having any fouls until the 3rd or all of them being pretty gross plays
In the thunder game the nuggets went the first 9 minutes without a foul in the first quarter. And then 10.5 minutes without one in the 4th. Thats just not possible unless you are willingly letting the other team score the second they touch the ball
I mean yeah nuggets defense is pretty trash
Nuggets defense is the best in the league after the break, so no. Missing the two best defensive players as well.
I mean that’s pretty common nuggets defence. Without Gordon, the nuggets don’t have a shot blocker once the guard beats his man - jokic in that game let shai, caruso and others through, rather than give up the and-1
There are a lot of hands involved but a lot of this is just them being able to stay in front of him and he has to use an elbow hook to try and get position
Teams do this to wemby every play and we run him off off-ball screens or just have him catch it high
Not sure that would work for Jokic tho
I feel like at pretty much any point in this clip you could blow the whistle and call simultaneous fouls. The one on Svi is pretty egregious though.
Oh I agree. By the rulebook there’s a full every second of this by both of them. Lots of blocking fouls by the defender and then lots of hooking and pushing by Jokic.
But they just don’t call that in the current NBA and I treat what refs actually call as the “NBA rulebook” otherwise I’m like one of those people that spans travel under every highlight
It’d help if CB would be any kind of a threat from 3pt range and if his man would not be so close to Jokic
So much for any sort of freedom of movement huh? D’d up!
Refs are pulling the ai treatment now. Timmy D was onto something.
What a vindictive bunch
He’s guarded and officiated waaaay differently compared to any other player in the NBA. All over the court and not only in the paint. I find it as a sign of ultimate respect but sometimes enough is enough.
Jazz are going to be so good next year. Hardy is a great coach. They were cooking his first year before ainge called in the tank
Ridiculous how players have a green light to absolutely manhandle Jokic but literally no one else in the league? It’s bullshit
Did we watch the same clip? Jokic gets beat to the spot every time
You can’t wrestle a player who’s legally fighting for position, which is what every defender seems to do to Jokic lol
Its so easy for the league to handicap a player.
That’s some good ass physical playoff style defense. Don’t let the big man get to his spot. Good shit
Okay that’s honestly insane😅😅😅 if that was Shai or Embiid, that defender would be thrown out of the game by now😭
it’s actually funny as shit it’s like the refs are in the group chat making bets for how much contact they’ll let him take before he snaps🤣
I honestly don’t know the rule here. If you are off-ball and have position on an offensive player, do you have to allow someone on offense to get to spots you control without significant resistance? It seems like Jokic wants to get to the other elbow at the free throw line to screen/get the ball, and he isn’t going to yield the positional battle until he is in an advantageous position against the defender. The problem for Jokic is the defender is already in position to deny that space, and the defender is obviously much faster with their footwork. Jokic then tries to reposition and anchor close to his desired spot, but he can’t find an advantageous position and gets frustrated because he would have to move too far away from the defender to get the ball without significant risk of it getting stolen.
There is contact the entire time, and I would say it’s substantial, but I really don’t know if that should be a foul or not. I don’t know if you have to yield position, or if this is a disadvantage Jokic will have to live with because he is slow and not the most athletic guy. Here, it looks like he is getting beat by the physicality of a strong defensive effort that won’t yield position, and he doesn’t want to take what the defense is giving him, so he tries to force it, but doesn’t have the strength/athleticism to win that battle from a disadvantaged position.
NBA being a laughing stock…dude wants physical and when you play on same level you got called. While SGA being weak and thin get all the touching call is so disgusting. You want more scoring but keep calling foul that unnecessary to slow the time
HE BEEN DOING THIS!!!
Getting mugged every trip? Ya you right finally
Nuggets fans pulling overtime trying to spin the narrative
Top 10 player of all time getting picked by a tanking jazz team
Is Jokic starting to slow down?
Jokic just plain dirty
Jokic thinks it’s illegal to defend him
Jokic is a big baby. Said it before, say it again. He wants to be the big guy but doesn’t like when other players get physical.
it was pretty ridiculous. There letting JOkic get assaulted tonight. Refs are letting Nuggets know there Utah refs tonight. How can you look at that and not call a foul on Utah.
Jokic is literally sitting on people
I did not see sitting at first
me next
as a smaller player, if Jokic is front them physically, they have an aspect of physicality they can use back as well. It’s not like they were binding his arms nonstop, they simply were getting low and fronting him
Jokic is just exaggerating every hit here lol that’s why he’s not getting a call
Bot or just dork?
The league is figuring jokic out
the trick is just foul him. They won’t call anything
Basically againt most bigs if you are smaller refs don’t care if you grab, hold, pull etc its honestly so stupid because then the second the big does it back the smaller player just falls and gets awarded a foul
Cope af lol
Jokić was the one who fouled here bud
That was the one that was called, did you see how many time the Jazz players grabbed him just to prevent him from actually getting to where he wanted to go?
The worst part of the warriors run is a bunch of people who don’t know about post positioning bc it legit went away for like 8 years lol
On that play? Zero times worth calling. Perhaps you meant throughout the game.
Lmfao if this is not satire please considering reframing this as satire.
“Beat the shit out of jokic and he will be less effective”
I obviously don’t agree with this. He literally just had a career year last season and was playing even better pre injury
But is funny to watch some Jokic games from a few years ago and a lot teams would straight up let him play on one or just hard double. Teams have began deploying much smarter coverages
We figured him out first :)
Yep. He’s not as dominant as before
yeah, good ole Utah with the notoriously good whistle. much more sensible than that there are just a lot of fouls called in this very physical game lmao
Refs are trash, we all know. Jokic is still not the same. Most of the time teams will stop him on the clutch. He’s been shooting bad for 3 and looks gassed out there. His defense is also terrible
I think maybe he looks gassed because he’s been playing football all night against your no whistle hack plan
He’s been the dirtiest player in the league since last playoffs started but he’s not even 10% as bad as prime Embiid was so I really don’t care tbh
You’re never gettin out the trailer park with that victim mentality