[Highlight] Gobert is assessed a flagrant 1 for a reckless closeout on Wembanyama, and based on the flagrant foul points he’s accumulated this season, he will be suspended for Tuesday’s game
Obligatory FUCK ZAZA
Bruce Bowen
Ty Lue
Agreed. No one should consider this the Zaza rule. That piece of shit Bowen needs to be the first name attached
I mean Bruce was dirty as shit and he did get in your landing space. And you hating him is all well and good.
Its the Zaza rule and for good reason.
I think Bruce got lucky that his antics never led to anything cataclysmic.
I mean didn’t Vince Carter, Steve Francis and other got injured by him because his foot is in their landing space?
Should’ve been Popovich rule since he encouraged that shit.
Im not saying Bruces never led to an injury. I called him dirty for a reason. Zaza literally altered a career and possibly a playoff series. Bruce never did that. And thats not a credit to him. Its just blind luck.
Thats the reason its named after Zaza.
Also you cats acting like Pop and Bruce invented this are killing me. Yes, Bruce is dirty. Yes Pop was wrong for being indignant about it. He should have just said nothing. But the pearl clutching is a little much especially from a Warriors fan.
Man he was a dickhead.
Always and forever
Obligatory FUCK POPOVICH AND BOWEN:
Popovich said Bowen is being singled out, citing incidents where New Jersey’s Richard Jefferson and Dallas’ Josh Howard sprained ankles after landing on Miami’s Shaquille O’Neal and Golden State’s Mickael Pietrus. “Did (the league) call them?” Popovich said. “Did they call all those guys (Dirk) Nowitzki landed on when he sprained his ankles the past three, four years? The answer is no. “So why did they call Bruce? Because it’s happened to him twice? Bruce guards an All-Star every night. If he was doing what they’re accusing him of doing, wouldn’t it have happened a higher percentage of times? “The people who cry about it are just frustrated about having to go against Bruce.” “The league is just trying to cover its ass,” Popovich said. “I told Bruce, ‘You be Bruce Bowen. You’re the best (expletive) defender in this league. You will NOT change the way you play defense.’ “Stu Jackson is not going to change my team just because he thinks he’s doing the right thing.”
Popovich said Bowen is being singled out, citing incidents where New Jersey’s Richard Jefferson and Dallas’ Josh Howard sprained ankles after landing on Miami’s Shaquille O’Neal and Golden State’s Mickael Pietrus.
“Did (the league) call them?” Popovich said. “Did they call all those guys (Dirk) Nowitzki landed on when he sprained his ankles the past three, four years? The answer is no.
“So why did they call Bruce? Because it’s happened to him twice? Bruce guards an All-Star every night. If he was doing what they’re accusing him of doing, wouldn’t it have happened a higher percentage of times?
“The people who cry about it are just frustrated about having to go against Bruce.”
“The league is just trying to cover its ass,” Popovich said. “I told Bruce, ‘You be Bruce Bowen. You’re the best (expletive) defender in this league. You will NOT change the way you play defense.’
“Stu Jackson is not going to change my team just because he thinks he’s doing the right thing.”
Bruce Bowen, being himself, decided to start kicking guys in the face
LOL at this being downvoted
I’ll always say it’s not the players but the league’s problem
If the league started to seriously suspend (not only one game) for trying to injure another player this would stop sooner than you think
where’s that fool spurs fan that said ‘coach pop would never’
Let it go bro it’s been nearly 20 years
I should go watch Russ clock Zaza
I know nobody cares but I had one shot in my bag.
Being able to absolutely wreck your ass was the deterrent.
I’d be out there getting killed by three guys and it was all legal.
Croissant on croissant crime
Oui
Probably a lot of butter involved.
Don’t get the other sub excited.
You’d think a 14 year veteran known for defence would be smarter than that…
Bruh, I’m all for player safety, but that was by no means a purposeful foot placement. Rudy contested it, he landed in the wrong spot, and now he has to pay the consequence for every flagrant leading up to this.
The correct call was made, but that’s far from a bonehead play.
I don’t see anything malicious here at all. Still the right call.
Yeah it’s not like he’s trying to hurt Wemby he’s just not used to having to close out so hard and it was reckless.
Agreed. Normal close out. Guy is huge
I agree. I mean, that’s his teammate on the national team FFS.
So many of these are like this. Like, I guess just never contest threes? The NBA game has gotten so convoluted it’s starting to eat its own tail.
It has nothing to do with purposeful foot placement, the rules were changed to rule out any amount of intention coming into it so we don’t have to contend with Ref bias. The issue isn’t so much this play but how he earned the previous flagrant points.
Wait Rudy Gobert is in his 14th year???? Holy shit I’m getting old
It’s been almost six years since he started Covid
I mean how many shots does he contest a game? Then multiply that by how many games he’s played in his career.
Its not insane that he messed up once lol
If anything he’s inexperienced in this particular aspect of defense.
He’s rarely closing out to shooters. And for most of the ones he does close out to, he’s considerably taller than them. I wouldn’t be surprised if Wemby’s height is the reason Rudy closed out so hard.
He wanted to challenge it too.
Bad take
Imo the fact that you have to close out like that on an off-balance step back from a 7’5 player is crazy.
he should probably have a least 5 more flagrants, from pushing guys mid-air
It be ya own
nobody likes Gobert, not even his own peoples
That shit was dirty intentions
What sense is there? I get it’s Rudy, but use your head a lil bit.
What could he possibly gain by injuring a friend and international teammate?
Wemby said his girl taste like escargot
Are they actually friends though?
Only based on everything we know about them.
this sub literally learned about wemby 6 years ago when a clip of a 16 yo wemby playing 1v1 vs gobert during summer popped up lol
they go way back at this point
I’m a n00b. What makes this a “reckless closeout”? I mean, I get that there was contact after he landed, but what specifically was against the rules?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRmTlaL2GlU
This is what enforcers did back in the old days. They finally created a rule after Kawhi’s injury.
This was basically Bill Laimbeer’s signature move back in the day
There has been so many injuries with guys purposely putting their feet under a jump shooter. Gotta give the shooter a clear path to land so he doesn’t get hurt.
It’s surprising that it would have to be against the rules to let a 7’4” man jump on your foot, but it makes perfect sense.
I was just looking at the wrong thing in the clips.
The problem isnt the jumper landing on the defenders foot, but the jumper landing on the defenders foot and then twisting his ankle or whatever other injury it may be
I get it but shooters/guards are so soft and get such pathetic calls…. Refs would NEVER call a flagrant on someone who lands under Rudy on any shit or dunk he takes. Obviously we gotta protect wemby but that’s because he’s a generational talent and plays like a guard
You could basically tackle a big man on a layup in the post or mid range and it’s a no call but if you are shooting a 3 and land on a player it’s a flagrant even if the shooter jumps forward 4 feet and leans into it…. Call it a normal shooting foul and move on if anything
even if the shooter jumps forward 4 feet and leans into it
Which isn’t what happened here. Rudy is free to learn to shoot like Wemby if you want him to be on the other side, or to just not put his feet under a guy shooting. Either one.
Agreed completely. Whole league is soft as shit.
Rudy didn’t need to come in THAT close and getting in wemby’s landing area causing him to land on Rudy’s foot. You need to leave some landing space for safety reasons
Landing zone of the shooter. See how Wemby came down on Gobert’s foot? As a defender you have to keep that landing zone clear of your feet.
It’s because he’s fr*nch
Defensive player went A-B, covering significant distance to end up into the landing zone of the shooter and create contact.
What makes this a “reckless closeout”? I mean, I get that there was contact after he landed, but what specifically was against the rules?
“Flagrant Foul, Penalty 1, defender steps under airborne shooter” What makes this a “reckless closeout”?
https://videorulebook.nba.com/archive/flagrant-foul-penalty-1-defender-steps-under-airborne-shooter-2/
Look at where Wemby’s feet are when he jumps, and look at where Gobert’s foot is when Wemby lands (directly under Wemby’s landing space).
Some NBA defenders like Bruce Bowen were notorious for “accidentally” placing their feet where the shooter would land. So finally the NBA made it illegal to reduce these occurrences, whether intentional or not.
Gobert was challenging a jump shooter, which is not allowed anymore in the NBA. If it were against a regular player it would just be a normal foul, but since it’s a star that automatically elevates it to a reckless closeout and thus a flagrant.
dawg even I can admit Rudy is quite clearly in his landing space
It is reckless to jump into the landing space of a guy like this. we’ve seen too many careers shortened by this shit man fuck off trying to justify it.
That’s so dangerous ugh
Reddit was crying about these calls being dumb when Luka got called for it the other night, but you can see why it’s so important to protect players landing zones. That’s an ankle injury or acl injury if wemby lands an inch more the wrong way.
Some of the calls are dumb. Players can launch themselves four feet forward and get draw a reckless close out call when the defender is contesting vertically. That’s a dumb call. This was a genuine reckless closeout because Wemby is going essentially straight up and down and Gobert jumps horizontally under him. Welcome to nuance.
There is a big difference between this play and Luka’s play last night: Wemby is jumping straight up and Gobert closes into his landing (but also initially jumping up) space. Luka closed out into KPJ landing space, but KPJ jumped forward to create that contact.
Both are fouls by current rules, but Wemby’s jump was an absolutely natural jump shooting motion that is a pure basketball play (ethical hoops) while KPJ jump shot was on purpose consisting of jumping forward to draw a foul (unethical hoops), so fans would have no issue with the foul on Gobert while foul on Luka seems more like an offensive player abusing current ruleset.
Gobert had to do a full extension to defend wemby on that play. It just shows he is playing at that edge and limit.
This shows he’s going over that edge
til about flagrant foul points, is that new thing?
Been around for a long time, its famously why Draymond missed game 5 of the 2016 finals.
Edit: Just using the waybackmachine to and nba.coms rule history, a one game suspension for five flagrant points has been a rule that existed since 1993-94.
This isn’t an exhaustive list but some players who were suspended for it also include:
Doing it against his fellow Frenchman is wild
It wasn’t a purposeful foot plant, it was just shit luck. Correct call was made, but let’s not act like Rudy planted his foot there in hopes of an injury.
Please don’t speak for us, thank you.
How many times are you going to comment this lmao
as much as I want
So many 5’6” dudes on their couches acting like it’s easy to contest wemby as 7’1” human and not have him land on your feet. Sure it’s dangerous and shouldn’t have happened but you’ll never convince me this wasn’t an accident.
It doesn’t have to be intentional for it to still be considered reckless.
Not saying it’s not a foul genius. I’m saying folks saying “Rudy should know better” are big idiots. This one of thousands of contests Rudy has and very few end this way. Wemby is fading away so his legs do come forward (not say he kicked out but it’s tougher to know where he’s landing). I’m saying this is a foul and accidents happen so let’s not pretend Rudy did some egregious knucklehead thing here. It’s was a basketball play that was slightly miscalculated by two of the most athletic seven footers we’ve ever seen
Calling a foul and upgrading it to a flagrant here isn’t about intent it’s about the avoidable potential harm.
If you accidentally hit a pedestrian with your car it’s still a crime. If you close out so hard in your effort to defend that your feet manage to wind up underneath the feet of a shooter’s landing space it’s still a foul.
If this had featured an SGA/Dort style of unnatural shooting motion and leg flailing then sure — any injury risk would’ve been the shooter’s fault — but Vic’s shooting motion here was incredibly predictable and avoidable. Especially for a 14 year vet and perennial DPOY.
Funny story, it’s actually not a crime to hit a pedestrian. At least nothing criminal happened to the woman that hit my son and me. And we had the walk signal in a crosswalk. Cops and EMS came. She didn’t even get a ticket. Which I wasn’t upset about. She felt horrible and it was an accident.
Thanks for the absolutely unnecessary dissertation following an inability to understand my point. It’s not about “intent”. My Point is this a seven footer defending a seven footer on a step back. It’s not some run of the mill play by some dudes at lifetime. First off i think it’s safe to assume most seven footers arent coordinated enough to do any of that (tbh these two might be the only ones). Second, it’s not like this is something that happens all the time for Rudy so what’s the point of acting all high and mighty when he obviously knows, things just happen quick, and it’s rare Rudy gets in this spot (the intent part you misunderstood). Third , tho it’s not a blantant kick out, wembys fading away so his legs flare a bit and it’s not as obvious as a normal jumper where he’s coming down. After all that wemby lands on a half inch of Rudy’s foot so let’s stop pretending this is some sorta crime and recognize it as an incredible display of athleticism by two 7footers that is a hair miscalculated and therefore a foul.Not “Rudy should know better”. Obviously he does and this is 1⁄500 contest so RELAX
I’m relaxed. You seem less so.
It’s exactly what it is called, a reckless closeout. Often players know they are taking a risk and being reckless when they do a closeout like this, hence why you sometimes see things get heated when it happens. Doesn’t make Gobert some kind of evil mastermind, but it is a reckless closeout and a risky play.
Gobert should be smarter than that
Why is everyone acting like he purposefully put his foot there? The correct call was made, but it wasn’t intentional.
People are saying he wasn’t smart, not that it was intentional. It was a reckless, careless closeout.
Brother that wasn’t a careless close out. Rudy contested the shot, as he should, and his foot landed when Wemby’s landed, which is a flagrant. A reckless close out would be him diving at Wemby’s hip. That was the most normal contest you can ask for.
Gobert lands about five feet from where he took off (A) to where he lands on his extended right leg (B). It’s pretty much indistinguishable from the definition of a reckless closeout from the NBA Referees Association website:
https://www.nbra.net/rules/flagrant-foul/
It’s literally a reckless closeout which is the call that was made. Doesn’t matter if it’s intentional or not. Rudy should be smarter than that
Jesus Christ, there’s a reason you try to avoid your 7 footers playing on the perimeter, they have much less body control
And they know that, which is why they should know better, even if they really really really want to contest a shot, that they have to be careful and not come out recklessly. The end result was an accident, but he did mean to jump with that much force, as he was trying to contest/block the shot.
No one said intentional? We said stupid and dangerous. Which it was.
He literally contested a jump shot. Nothing stupid about. If his foot landed 6 inches from where it did in almost any direction, it’s a non factor and no one bats an eye.
He contested a jumper by recklessly launching himself at the shooter, obstructing the shooter’s landing area, and putting the shooter at risk of serious injury.
This isn’t hypothetical. That exact type of close out has destroyed knees and ankles. It’s an automatic flagrant for a reason. Take off the Homer glasses.
It wasn’t bad luck.. it was a reckless closeout and ended with a potential injury. The exact reason the rule was introduced. Don’t act like he was just unlucky when his play was absolutely reckless
Dude, take a breath. You’re working so hard trying to defend Gobert. It’s gotta wear you down.
Have to defend a guy when he’s being wrongfully accused of being a dirty player.
Reckless and dirty are two different things. Good effort executed poorly is reckless when it directly results in a play that has a high chance of injury, which is what these landing space fouls are.
Idk how you think anyone is saying he’s playing dirty. The rule is there because people get hurt and its your responsibility as a defender to be aware of where you plant around an airborne shooter.
It’s not dirty. It’s dumb.
Uh no bro he isnt
licks microphone at press conference
Gobert should be smarter than a lot of things. Sadly, he’s not.
Should be, but he doesn’t want to be
the crowd booing like it’s not the most blatant reckless closeout I’ve ever seen lol
Fans will boo anything
That wasn’t blatant by any means. It was an unfortunate landing spot, but Rudy didn’t look at his feet to make sure he landed right under Wemby.
100% a flagrant, but stop with the narrative that Rudy is head hunting.
It was extremely blatant, whether or not it was done to intentionally cause harm is a different story
Yes it was blatant, no it was not intentional. End of story.
That’s … Thats What they were originally saying 😅😂
It’s exactly why the rule exists. Luckily Wemby wasn’t hurt.
Those ultra flexible Dhalsim joints come in handy
YOGA FLAME
It pretty much a text book reckless closeout - A to B & into the landing space.
So I was there, and we didn’t know what they were looking at. To the people around me it looked like Wemby kicked his legs out a bit on the replays they showed in the arena. Based on what people are saying here, I guess we were wrong. C’est la vie.
It is what it is, that crowd was incredible to be a part of.
So, cram it up your cram hole Lafleur.
He was just falling over at any single touch, along with Castle. Folks were restless.
Bro in our game thread against the wolves I made an off hand comment about how dumb OKC fans are but the arena in Minnesota is being hella stupid that night and I was ROASTED for it. It was like I wrote their sisters’ names on the water towers or something
Edit: down vote me more dorks
Nah I’m with you, Wolves fans are a special kind of stupid
If I could read I would be really offended.
Fortunate that wemby wasn’t hurt there
Yves Saint Flagrant
At first I thought I wasn’t going to agree with this call but yeah that was just dumb
It’s the right call, while also dumb.
Why dumb?
Wemby went straight up and down too. That’s crazy.
i hope rudy doesn’t get suspended. Rudy, that was dumbass close out.
He’s suspended, due to his flagrant count on the season.
Bro is asking for the challenge lmao
He already has that many flagrant points to be suspended? lol
NBA I’d dying because of this flopping league
Lots of commenters in here have never played basketball and been over 6 ft tall.
what the hell is supposed to do?
Gobert know’s Wembanyama long enough.
He’s a right handed shooter so you hedge the right and give up the left in order to get a better fly by contest with the opposite hand.
With a right handed shooter, left hand contest and vice-versa.
You can’t contest shots anymore with the same hand as the shooter when standing in front because the defender’s body is going to end up directly in front of the offensive player because their momentum carries them there.
Weak
This is the correct situation to call this in.
Gobert is one of the dirtiest players in the league… He’s an absolute fucking snake.
Yet acts so innocent every time he gets caught.
Needs a career ending injury so he doesn’t hurt anyone else
[ Removed by Reddit ]
Frog on Frog crime
Is he not suppose to jump? Just let the 7’6” guy shoot?
Ok I thought only unsportsmanlike techs got you suspended?… Am I misinterpreting what the rules are?
Nah there’s points. When you get so many auto-suspension.
That is a regarded foul. And it won’t keep Wendy’s safe long term either.
Stupid play by Rudy, I get that hes just playing hard D but you gotta make sure to be disciplined. Damn near cost us the game
This looks innocent to me not like Bruce Bowen
I really think it’s special that they’re gradually staging the game to eventually combine the NBA with the WNBA!!!
Yeah this is one of the more blatant reckless closeouts I have seen
“reckless close outs” have become pretty subjective and flagrant fouls on them are usually not appropriate. Most of the time defenders are just playing defense and the foul is determined to be reckless. It’s one of the many things that makes the nba tough to watch these days. It’s just ref play. All game long.
Gotta protect the golden boy, nobody wants to see those ankles twist live. Adam silver just gulped like goofy.
Sending Rudy a message so the whole league knows.
The difference in Wemby’s shooting form, mostly straight up and natural, to some of the other shots where players are trying to draw this foul, really shows how badly players are trying to minipulate this rule.
If you shoot like Wemby did you should absolutely be able to come down safely. This is a stupid and unsportsmanlike foul by Rudy.
lu dort move
Wemby didn’t go straight up and down. He kicked out a little. League soft as hell now days
this is so dangerous, it should be a flagrant2 and ejection
They don’t want to see Goatbert succeed
DPOY! /s
Lakers fan commenting on defense /s
This is such a stupid rule. Why would this ever be a flagrant.
Reckless close outs have been a flagrant foul for the last 5 years and it’s a good thing they crack down on them because it can end careers.
I know brother I watch basketball. I’m complaining about the rule existing. Jumping and landing on a defender’s foot while grabbing a rebound also ends careers but thats not a foul let alone a flagrant.
Physicality is expected in the post. There’s no reason why a defender needs to step forward and get in the landing zone on a 3 point shot
Why is an SA fan complaining about this being a flagrant. Do you want Wemby’s knees to be broken?
I want rules that make sense. Also Wemby has like the most resilient and flexible ligaments in the league, he’s the last guy I’d worry about when it comes to stuff like this.
Remember Zaza and Kawhi?
I remember Bruce Bowen too if it’s any better.
You need to give a player clear landing space. If he has nowhere to land his feet and then rolls his ankle, it can lead to miss a lot of games from it. Like I’m all for getting rid of the whole “defender fouled because he stood there while the offensive player jumped forward 10 ft” stuff, but this isn’t one of those cases.
Sure it’s a foul, but why a flagrant? considering that if the same exact thing happens but not during a shot it’s not even a foul. Do ankles not roll when jumping for a rebound?
Shit is ass, i agree.
You turn on NBA and legit may watch a foul on 8 straight drives because a touch + a flop = auto foul
Way too many pauses compared to actual play.
Gobert always been dirty what’s new
Show me the part where he purposefully positioned himself to have Wemby land on his foot
Gobert is such a dirty player
I don’t know how some people can be fans of his
Well said, u/DirtyDraymond
…seriously?
Surely you aren’t falling for bait