Cooper Flagg in the first half vs Denver- 22/4/4 1 STL 1 BLK on 9⁄10 FG and 3⁄3 3FG
He keeps getting better every game
https://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore/_/gameId/401810270
He’s even better than we thought he was, he can and will be a number one option on a contender.
His ceiling is Jayson Tatum on steroids
He is the Luka Doncic of Jayson Tatums
I mean he’s 19 late Tate right
When Jayson Tatum came to the league be had to become a better version of what Cooper Flagg is now with the passing along with the scoring. What the fuck is this kid going to turn into it’s so exciting
why on steroids? I think his ceiling is very much Jayson Tatum, without any additional qualifiers needed.
he will be greater than him on defense. tatum is a great defender, flagg has all nba 1st team potential in the future
Not really saying much when Tatum already is 1st team defense level and should’ve already won it at least once 🤷♂️
I can comfortably name you 15 better defenders than him, even one on his own team. stop playing man.
bruh, have you seen Tatum play D ? The guy was legit their best defender.
He absolutely has not. He thinks “Derrick White” is their best defender. It’s like saying GP2 is better than Draymond
LMFAOO brown and/or white are NOT better than Tatum defensively, I don’t even need to hear the rest of the bs you gotta say gtfo
Flagg is significantly better than Tatum was at this age. Not even close. You’d have to predict Flagg’s development stalls out for his ceiling to be Tatum
Development is not a linear function of age. Sure, Flagg is ahead of where Tatum is at the same age. But what if Flagg is already closer to his ceiling than Tatum was?
I am viewing this from another perspective:
Tatum is great at everything, truly elite (say, top 2 for multiple seasons) at nothing.
Right now, Flagg’s ceiling seems to be the same - great at everything, truly elite at nothing. Do you think he has elite potential in any area of the game?
Flagg has potential to be elite on D and arguably has potential to be an elite scorer. He’s already incredible from inside the arc and his ft% suggests he’ll have positive regression in his 3Pt shooting.
Positive regression. Progression?
Pregrossion
flagg has a fluidity in his movement and a feel for the game that tatum never had at that age. its natural to assume flagg has a higher ceiling because through practice he can still improve in all the other ways that tatum did – shot efficiency, more muscle mass, better playmaking, better defense.
It’s like watching Luka donic. It’s just so easy when he’s having a good game. I’ve watched some early cooper flagg mav games. He’s a different player today. 100% worth the hype now.
Once he starts to instinctually defend and attack he’s going to be a triple double monster.
Even his passing ability and ball handling ability is good enough to be a legit ball handler now. He’s learning so quickly.
His ability to get into the paint and find good shots is very mature for an 18-19 y/o rookie. I think that footwork off two feet in the lane a la Jimmy Butler will be a staple of his game and make him truly elite on offense.
The mfer just turned 19 doing this stuff though
Almost any of those knocks on any rookie would be delusional. Saying all of it together is just insane. Saying it about coop after the historic shit he does night in and night out before the all star break in his rookie season is a special kind of stupid.
He played 30 NBA games ffs
This is you replying to your own comment.
what knocks? All the comparison in the bullet points are about Tatum’s prime vs. other stars primes.
All I am saying is that I don’t see Flagg becoming truly elite at anything. Obviously I could be wrong, he just played 30 games. But all others who predict an MVP-level career could be wrong too.
what knocks?
The four knocks on Tatum that you feel confident transferring over to Flagg based on 30 games that are more promising than the first 30 games of ANY player you compared Tatum/Flagg with.
All I’m saying
All I’m saying is the predictions from “all the others” are plainly stupid but understandable given the hype. On the other hand, your predictions and the basis of comparison you’re relying on for them go far beyond stupid.
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my entire point is that comparing rookie stats is useless, to estimate ceiling. I am comparing flashes of what they show they can be.
And sure, obviously my opinion is fundamentally just based on my interpretation of the games. He played 30 NBA games ffs
Right but you’re comparing rookie stats to prime stats which is objectively way more useless
No, I was comparing Tatum’s prime vs. other stars’s primes.
Are we acting like the teams they were drafted to aren’t impacting their performance? Tatum didn’t want to go to the Celtics because of the talent on the team.
Flagg could become the greatest ever for all I know but Tatum didn’t have the volume to do more than he did.
yeah Tatum wasn’t asked to be a primary option for us until the postseason and he responded by scoring the second most playoff points by a rookie ever after Kareem lol.
I love Flagg and I think he could 100% end up being better than Tatum but as usual this sub underrates how good JT is
Took LeBron to game 7 in the conference finals, and people are downplaying how great he was and is lmao.
People (children) not liking Tatum because he doesn’t have “aura” has morphed into him not actually being good in their eyes and it’s un-fucking-real.
The dude is objectively incredible at basketball and gets so little shine for it. And Flagg is fucking great too and might have a higher peak! Or it could end up that he’s closer to his peak now than the average rookie (since we’ve known for years how talented and physically dominant he is relative to his peers). Who knows.
I loathe the Celtics, but the Tatum slander is so dumb.
He’s got an ultra competitive nasty streak as well.
When he gets done being the humble rookie paying his dues, he’s gonna start serving fools
not even close is a stretch. Tatum had a much more polished offensive skillset than Flagg as a rookie particularly in terms of ball-handling and shooting
Flagg is ahead of rookie Tatum as a defender and a much more dominant driver/slasher. I’m not sure I buy Tatum had a huge edge as a ballhandler either. At the very least, if Tatum did have the edge in ballhandling, then Flagg has the edge in vision/passing by a significant degree.
I agree that not even close as rookies is a little unfair, but you also have to remember that the guy you’re reply to said, “at this age.” Definitely a significant distinction. Tatum was like .75 years older when drafted than Flagg. Tatum at 19 years flat was playing regular season ACC ball.
yeah I’m not even disagreeing that Flagg’s better than Tatum at the same age - his finishing, defense, IQ and vision are definitely ahead of where Tatum was - I just felt like calling it “not even close” was a bit of an exaggeration. Flagg’s awesome though, probably the best teenage player I’ve seen since Luka ironically lmao
His ceiling is definitely above Tatum based on how good he is right now
There are a few in this sub furiously fighting to stake their claim that Flagg’s absolute ceiling is Tatum. Why? I don’t know. That never made sense for those that watched the game in game out development of both players in college/early pro ball. They’re either doubters trying to hold on or big Tatum fans. They’ll see eventually.
Also, frankly, I don’t think early tatum’s ceiling is current tatum, right?
Like if there were 10k mulitverses starting right at tatum entering the NBA, do you think the current tatum is the best one we’d get? I don’t, even though he’s a top 5ish player.
Watch him and you’ll realize the fascination some of us here have with the kid. He’s getting significantly better after each month.
In October i would have said he’s good but not remarkable. He may not be a franchise player this season or maybe next season.
Then in November I would say today was the ceiling for the end of the year.
After today… He is for sure a franchise player. He’s going to be a triple double monster next season.
I think Tatum on steroids is a good description of his ceiling. Flagg is way more explosive than Tatum ever was.
A supercharged version of Tatum….soooo, kinda like that guy from Akron, Ohio that wears 23? Oh, but were not allowed to make that comp…
would you say peak kawhi > tatum? i would
i think flagg has a chance to be as good as peak kawhi
Tatum also wilts in the playoffs. Boston has great team success not because of any carry job from Tatum.
its not a carry job, but he lead the team in pts, reb and asists, thats something and its not like kawhi winning with the raptors didnt have a great team around him, he was more efficient then tataum, but other things are pretty much the same
You must’ve literally never watched a Celtics playoff game
What if I watched this one https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/202305030BOS.html
Where he was 1-7 for 7 points and the Celtics won in a blowout anyway.
Or during the championship run when he had several games of like 15 points, and Jaylen Brown was FMVP despite Tatum being the better regular season player by a lot.
Where am I wrong here? Or do you go by feelings, vibes and downdoots? Imbecile.
Lol loser comment. What about 46 in Milwaukee game 6 or 50+ against philly game 7? Or the game he tore his Achilles where him and Brunson were going bucket for bucket? What about when he lead his team in points, rebounds, and assists in a finals run, something only a handful of guys have done? You know nothing nephew
I love Tatum’s game but it took him a good two years of NBA experience to get to the level Flagg seems to be at right now, and flaggs insanely young for an NBA player, almost a year younger than Tatum as a rookie
Flagg is drafted out of HS age. He should right now be in college as a one and done.
the 18th youngest to ever play in the NBA
That’s too low a ceiling for coop
Jayson Tatum with aura
If he ends up as Tatum that’s a massive disappointment
His ceiling is Jayson Tatum. Jayson Tatum on steroids is a top 20 player of all time.
His Ceiling is top 10 all time easily, only other player that did what Coops done at 18 is LeBron.
Scoring is inflated drastically nowadays. If you look at his stats this season, he is right in line with Kon Knueppel in scoring. You wouldn’t say Knueppel is going to be anywhere close to a top 10 player.
That’s an insult to cooper
So raptors kawhi?
Speak for yourself, he was the best player in college basketball at 17
Something Luka couldn’t even accomplish smh
he’s definitely already the #1 on this team
The narrative when he was drafted was disrespectful. All of a sudden “he’ll be lucky to be a #2 on a winning team”, “he’s Detlef Schrempf”, “he wouldn’t be the best player in another years draft” Flagg had perhaps the least flawed college game I’ve ever seen.
It’s silly. Age wise that should have been his HS senior year.
I honestly thought Flagg could and would be this good……..in 4-5 years lol. I knew the kid was gonna be good, but damn I had no clue it would happen this fast.
How are we supposed to stop both him and AD on Christmas Day 😭😭😭😭😭
Cooper’s gonna be a #1 option on a champion.
He ain’t leaving dallas
The Flaggship player?
Time to trade him to the Lakers of course, for Jaxson Hayes.
Honestly might get some backlash but I think he’ll be a better offensive player then Wemby . His growth has been crazy but his decision making n bbiq on offence is better then Wemby and in banking in that ; tho obv if Wemby drammatically improved it’s different but I can see Flagg being better offensively.
He is everything we could have hoped for. Just has the absolute worst way of getting to us.
No ceiling on him if that three starts falling
Meanwhile Ace Flagg is averaging 4 points a game coming off the bench for the 1-13 Maine Black Bears as his twin sitting on the couch watching this shit going what the fuck.
Coop should apologize for absorbing all of his basketball skill in the womb
Gotta feel bad to be his brother. Will forever be know as Cooper’s brother and not Ace.
I mean that’s like 98% of pro athlete siblings, better to have a brother who’s gunna make hundreds of millions of dollars and be anonymous
Thats gotta be a coaching issue
Nah, they’re fraternal twins, not identical. They have different genetics. Basically two regular siblings that just happened to be born at the same time.
Cameron Boozer also has a fraternal twin brother who is in a similar boat.
The Boozers ain’t as good twins as the Thompsons but they ain’t as bad as the Flaggs. Purely from a collective talent standpoint.
Yeah while neither is all-world there’s a BIG difference between 5ppg on a terrible Maine team and 7ppg on a championship contending Duke team
You never watched him play, he’s better than 5ppg on Maine trust me.
The ceiling is the roof
Except when additional floors or addicts in attics are in between.
Dude’s already shooting 3⁄3 from deep tonight, that ceiling is about to get blown off lmao
A freshly 19 year old kid is the best player on a team with AD and Kyrie lol he’s generational
I mean Kyrie hasn’t played with him this year but yeah he’s very good man. This team with Kyrie looks dangerous for sure.
To be honest, I’m a pretty big fan of AD, and I did expect the Mavs to get better in the short term AFTER ADDING FLAGG. Like, I’ve been hearing about this prospect for 5+ years. He better be good.
How does that even happen? Like how does a 19 year old become so fucking good so fast?
Puberty
Oh right so few players go through puberty before the age of 19
When you’re the best in NCAA by a mile, that translates favorably to the NBA. Flagg is indeed generational and it’s showing.
And he has a twin brother that is struggling to adapt to D1 ball and most likely won’t even sniff the league, compared to Cooper who is already figuring out the NBA and playing very well. Crazy how one twin can win the genetic lottery.
Coop gonna pull a Giannis and get his bro a bag 🤣
Welcome the new Mavs generation Dwight Powell
coop is also several inches taller which matters a lot
Well, he’s a couple inches taller, but yeah. He’s also longer. He really lucked out on the genes.
and he’s still growing
I believe they are fraternal twins, so as genetically similar as a normal pair of siblings would be. He definitely did though, would be hard not to be a little bitter being the “lesser” twin
Talent lol
Just Nico Things
Anthony Davis is clearly a better player than Flagg at this point
Yeah certainly More impactful . Love both tho . AD opens up so much for Flagg too
he’s just still slightly better at everything compared to Flagg and obviously a much better rebounder.
This subreddit has no idea what generational means lmao
Mavericks really got bailed out by getting another generational talent, which potentially can be better than Luka.
fortune favours the bold
Build Nico the statue (and then pull it down like Sadams)
We’re starting to see the vision
Audentes fortuna iavat
He’s gonna be fantastic. Better than Luka is probably a stretch though.
s tier court vision is hard to surpass.
luka is in such rare company.
Two way superstar is also pretty rare!
You’re not wrong, but a lot of two way stars don’t peak at both ends at the same time, and those who do rarely maintain that level of productivity.
Cooper is a fantastic passer, tho
He’s good and likely to get better but Luka is one of the best in the history of the league. There’s really no comparison there.
he has elite court vision, but luka is like history of nba s tier, would you say?
he’s still about a universe away from Luka
He doesn’t have to match Luka on scoring. Say he averages 25 a game and is elite defender. He’s at 18ppg right now rookie year. Not saying he’s going to better ever than Luka at scoring, but a complete package can be.
Better defender than Luka, obviously. But he’ll never match Luka’s scoring or his passing ability – Luka is a generational offensive hub (who is still only 26 btw).
Yes which is why I said he doesn’t have to match Luka on scoring.
Passing I agree, scoring though? Don’t agree at all. His slashing and ability to get to the rim at his age is eerily similar to LeBron. If he develops a good 3 Flagg could score 30 a night easily.
You’re providing a big ‘if’ for a potential of scoring 30 a night. Luka is already a 34 ppg scorer who can score from anywhere as soon as he crosses the half-court line.
This isn’t to discredit Flagg btw, but Luka is an obscene scorer.
I’m not, everything about flaggs game is projectable to get better. The easiest way to score in basketball is 2 pointers at the rim, something Flagg is already very good at. His shooting, FTs per game, and even slashing will all get better. He’s steadily improving every game this season and will likely finish the season averaging 20, a year behind in development from every other star rookie that came before him. He will be like LeBron in that he won’t average 30, but could easily average 30 if he wanted.
Nobody can go off for 40+ on any given night like Luka can
I agree and don’t think Cooper will be putting up 40 every night , but scoring isn’t the only stat even though it’s the sexiest
Luka has Kevin Durant levels of scoring with some of the best passing and court vision we’ve ever seen
I’d go as far to say that he’s just as consistent as KD is scoring wise while also being able to take it to a completely other level (40 to 50 to 60 and his absolute best at 73 points on any given night if needed)
I’m a big Luka fan but his shooting has been hit or miss for a huge portion of the season so far. Something feels off and he’s getting bailed out by free throws whenever he has a bad shooting night.
Yes but he’s also such a particular playstyle and has certain deficiencies where you can question if you can build a true championship team around him. Like the Mavs were basically a 99th percentile team building job around him and still had basically 0 chance against the Celtics. Flagg you can certainly build a winner around and you likely need a less specific set of complementary players
The annoying thing, and something I will never be able to recover from, is that I’d say the Mavs were about a 90th percentile team building job around him. Then after the Finals the team saw the clear remaining weaknesses of the roster and plugged them perfectly, replacing Green, THJ, and DJJ w/ Naji, Grimes, and Klay.
That ended up w/ a basically perfect rotation at full health of Luka/Kyrie/Dinwiddie/Exum/Grimes/Klay/Naji/PJ/Maxi/Lively/Gafford. And then we never got to see that team given a playoff run.
Luka isn’t as efficient as Durant though. KD’s consistency and efficiency is only challenged by SGA’s and Michael Jordan’s (Jokic isn’t as consistent because he playmakes too much imo)
A hilarious stretch.
Have you guys forgotten about Luka? Really now?
I know you’re very excited about Cooper Flagg but jesus, the recency bias is out of control here.
Flagg is giving me hope and it’s a hell of a drug. Let us be delusional for a bit. He’s going to better than Luka.
Luka? What a bum, he had like 47/15/14 against the Kawhi-PG healthy Clippers and took them to 7 I think in his 2nd year, also All-NBA 1st, was he even any good?
It’s not a stretch.
Flagg won’t have a weakness at Luka’s age.
His three point shooting has been terrible so far
If he becomes even average tho lol
It’ll improve. He has all the signs of a decent shooter
tbf he’s had a thumb injury on his shooting hand. and in college it took him some time to figure it out
Flagg is a better defender lol
He likely won’t have his playmaking or offensive ceiling either though.
How about better defender than Luka
Luka can’t play D.
Of course it is, but this is r/nba where people think every good new player is also “generational”
Insane
rumors of his demise were greatly exaggerated
You know I looked it up a while back to confirm and was disappointed to see the actual quote is “The report of my death was an exaggeration”. Still good, but not nearly as good as the one we have all come to believe was real.
The meme version is from Megamind, “My death was greatly exaggerated”. The actual quote did happen even if something else inspired it.
It’s a quote from Mark Twain that has been copied dozens if not hundreds of times. Megamind wasn’t the first and won’t be the last.
After one preseason game people were saying he was overrated
I had the stank face alot that half
It suck the Mavs got bailed out, but thank god San Antonio didn’t win the lottery.
They’d have the two best players in the league in 2032.
Holy shit the league would’ve been over. They would’ve been the best defensive front court already. And in 2-3 years they woulda been the best of all time.
The current best defensive front court of all time, ofcourse being their original twin towers Duncan and d rob. Fuck those guys
😂😂 we up
Harper is a helluva consolation prize tbf.
Such fucking horse shit they got him, Harper is also really good and these mfs won 30 games last year and only because wemby was out
I think Harper is already going to be a star. He didn’t get the same amount of opportunity as some of these guys did I mean he is playing on a contender, with Fox and Castle, but he’ll be good
No 1 pick for a reason
Bruh, if he gets that 3 point shot, it’s over.
I love when the generational prospects live up to the hype. Kid is incredible, what a draft class.
Generational
That boy nice
He looks like he’s having a ton of fun out there just playing basketball. Keep it up Coop!
KOC’s such a fking idiot lol
Cooper really gonna be a generational talent man
Nico saw 14 million realities and chose the one that got the Mavs cooper. #nicowasright /s
GOAT
kids….smh
Now do Anthony Marshawn Davis
Already the best player on the team at 19. Crazy shit
Reminder: at Flagg’s current age, Luka was over 7 months away from making his NBA debut.
To be fair Doncic was euro league winner and mvp, not a small accomplishment at that age
has the potential to be the best Cooper ever
Mini slander
Cooper is going to be one hell of a problem if he keeps developing his game more over the next few years.
NAHHHHHH HES HIM IM OUT
More!
He’s evolving
He is certified, a worthy #1 pick
This guy was getting wait too much slander at the start of the year.
BBQ CHICKEN IN THE PAINT
I think we owe Nico an apology. /s
Where the fuck was this yesterday
Where my bust bros at
And good at defending
I’m glad the Luka Flagg trade worked out
Monster dunk on Jokic
Kon is having a historically great rookie season and Flagg is going to still annihilate him in RotY voting. Dallas got a good one.
Flagg has been masterful.
Denver’s defense has also been atrocious and there are five dudes on Denver tonight (Cam, Watson, Jones, Strawther, Bruce) who have been as terrible as Flagg has been amazing.
We’re shooting way over our season average, the nuggets made it much closer by end of half. I expect to lose this game, but that’s ok as long as it’s fun to watch.
Mavericks match up very well with Denver we have athleticism and size in the front court and wings.
Luka who?