I still stand by ⁶⁵⁄₈₂ just isn’t that many games. A major injury causing you to miss out on season long awards is a feature not a bug 

How many of these guys came close?

The 2 guys you mentioned played 50 games and 46 games. I think it’s good that if you miss almost half the season then you shouldn’t be considered for awards.

How much of your legacy should be impacted by not being available? Players of the past would be able to play 82 games or at least play most of the season they played in.

Injuries have always affected player’s legacies. If they miss a large portions of a season, they shouldn’t get awards for that season.

AD gets forgotten even in injury lists these days. Got traded away from the Lakers and the general NBA fanbase forgot he exists

Players like Gary Payton get dinged historicaly for having a low field goal percentage and Per 36 averages. But he averaged 81 games a season in the ultra physical 1990s. His toughness, leadership, and superlative effort on defense was valued more than his statistics.

Gary Payton didn’t have the benefit of resting minor injuries during the season. He had to play the next game every time Karl Malone tried to elbow his face off. He had to outplay Stockton on defense even though the league allowed Stockton to punch players hands and arms all game long.

Zero-time All Stars Chet and Franz are not stars

I really don’t care about all-nba honors and have no problem with this

I don’t mind the 65 game limit, but you will have years where a few guys miss the limit and now suddenly a player who would be Fifth Team All-NBA (if such thing existed) make the 2nd team and is max-contract eligible.

Be interesting to see how the teams control their spending.

I LOVE it and I would also consider making all statistical awards based on totals like they were in the past.

Its the regular season, you need to be judged for what you did in those 82 games. Playing 78 games is a lot more valuable than 63, reward the players who play.

It wouldn’t be a problem if the voters had properly weighed it for games played. I have no problem with someone putting up MVP numbers over 60 games making the 3rd team. But 1st team? You missed ¹⁄₄ of the season. It was necessary to implement IMO.

Players should not be rewarded for not playing enough games

If we extrapolate shortened seasons to 82 games or look at it as a percentage (79.3% of games):

Every MVP in history has played 65+ games except Bill Walton in 77-78 played 58 games

Every DPOY in history has played 65+ games except Kawhi Leonard (14-15) was 1 game short, Jaren Jackson Jr (22-23) was 2 games short and Rudy Gobert (17-18)

Every ROY has played 65+ games except Patrick Ewing (85-86), Brandon Roy (06-07), Kyrie Irving (11-12) and LaMelo Ball (20-21)

All-NBA has been a bit more spotty but this feels like a recent problem. From 1990-91 to 2022-23, here are the All-NBA players who played under 65 games:

1990-91: Bernard King (64) and Hakeem Olajuwon (56)

1994-95: Dennis Rodman (49)

1995-96: Shaquille O’Neal (54)

1996-97: Shaquille O’Neal (51) and Anfernee Hardaway (59)

1997-98: Shaquille O’Neal (60) and Scottie Pippen (44)

2001-02: Chris Webber (54)

2005-06: Shaquille O’Neal (59) and Yao Ming (57)

2006-07: Yao Ming (48) and Dwyane Wade (51)

2007-08: Yao Ming (55)

2011-12: Dwyane Wade (49)

2013-14: Chris Paul (62)

2014-15: DeMarcus Cousins (59)

2016-17: Kevin Durant (62)

2017-18: Joel Embiid (63), Stephen Curry (51) and Jimmy Butler (59)

2018-19: Joel Embiid (64), Kawhi Leonard (60) and LeBron James (55)

2019-20: Kawhi Leonard (79.2%), Russell Westbrook (79.2%) and Ben Simmons (78.1%) all at 57 out of ⁷²⁄₇₃ games

2020-21: Kawhi Leonard (52), Joel Embiid (51), LeBron James (45), Jimmy Butler (52), Paul George (54), Kyrie Irving (54)

2021-22: Ja Morant (57), Kevin Durant (55), Stephen Curry (64), LeBron James (56)

2022-23: Giannis Antetokounmpo (63), Stephen Curry (56), Jimmy Butler (64), Damian Lillard (58), LeBron James (55)

And then the 65 game rule was implemented. Sure, past eras had some guys win awards with less than 65 games like Shaq’s All-NBA’s, and I’m giving Yao a pass because his career was legitimately cut short by injuries, he was quite literally never healthy. But look at the amount of names since 2017-18 who wouldn’t have been All-NBA if we had the 65 game rule. We went from 0-2 names each year to basically excusing 3 guys for not playing enough and saying it’s fine.

But it’s not a good look when LeBron can’t hit the threshold 4 times in 5 years not even being close, then has it in him to play 70+ games in back to back years once it’s a rule. It’s not a good look for the biggest player in the sport.

65 games is a good rule when clearly players are capable of playing that unless they’re just extremely injury prone, which is true for any era. It’s unfortunate in seasons where players get injured and barely miss the 65 games and that’s just bad luck, but we had 7 guys from 2021-2023 not even play 70% of the games and that’s nearly as many as we had from 1991-2017

I am interested in knowing which players would not have made the All NBA teams in the 2010s. I would have imagined that voters would have taken injury into account.

Actually showing up and playing the games is a very important part of who the best players are

The best ability is availability.

Lol Luka and Wemby didn’t deserve to make an all nba team

Wemby played 46 games, Luka played 50

You can’t convince me that Wemby in 46 games had more value than JDub did in 69

All nba teams aren’t supposed to be “rank the 15 best players” it’s supposed to be “rank the 15 best seasons by a player” and sitting 40% of the games is a disqualifier

I do think there should be a softer limit because if Luka played 64 games he would be significantly more valuable than Dub at 69 or Brunson at 65 but nobody should be winning the award if they missed 40% of the season

I really think arbitrary cutoffs are stupid. If a guy plays 64 games and averages 37 points, 25 combined rebounds/assists, a fistful of stocks, and his team wins 59 of those games while having a losing record when he sits, should he still not be a serious contender for every award out there?

How it will look historically saddens me. We have always factored in availability with awards on our own. Now certain top 10 talents will go completely by the wayside because they’re like Embiid or Kawhi and can’t stay healthy. Embiid would have 2 all NBA season and Kawhi would have 3 with those rules which is the same as DeMar, Kyrie, and DeAndre Jordan, Julius Randle, and Pascal Siakam.

What’s the definition of a star player for this? You have guys listed who have never been an all star, on an all NBA team or all defense team.

Did anyone accidentally load manage their way into it?

Several of those guys you mentioned are a) seriously injury prone and b) on bad teams, which in many cases is a result of their injuries. They don’t deserve to make all NBA regardless of the games limit.

40 year old lebron james suffered a groin injury at still made the cutoff. I know lebron is an anomaly but he’s also 4 decades old and 65 games is not an insane ask of a professional athlete.

How many NFL QBs would be in the MVP race if they only played 12 games? Basketball is the only sport that cares more about per game numbers than raw totals. Part of having a great season is being healthy. 

I still think the best balance is ⁶²⁄₈₂

I’ve never understood why someone would be against a game requirement. That’s 17 games a player is allowed to provide ZERO value for. That seems like a lot and entirely fair to me.

I actually take it a step further, and think even beyond the requirement, games played should be weighed heavier than it is. If two players are in contention for MVP and provide similar impact, but one played 78 games and the other 66, I think that should be a huge factor. That’s 12 entire games that one player provided value while the other didn’t.

Durant had 62 making him miss out by 3 games. He also sat the remaining 8 games of the season.

Personally, I hate this arbitrary 65 game rules for one huge reason: voters already took missed games into consideration. IIRC, only around 5% of all All NBA selections in NBA history failed to hit that 65 game minimum so it was already basically accounted for. But then you have huge monetary bonuses also tied to that. Just looking at this season, Jalen Williams was an All NBA 3rd team selection putting up basically 22/5/5 on 57% TS. Durant, for example, put up 27/6/4 on 64% TS. And before anyone brings up team record: having a losing record doesn’t disqualify you from All NBA selections. Kobe Bryant made All NBA on a 35 win team, LeBron made it on a 33 win team, Damian Lillard made it on a 33 win team, Tracy McGrady made it on a 21 win team, etc. Keep into consideration, a lot of those supermax bonuses are dependent on All NBA selections. It’s why Tyrese Haliburton rushed back from injury last year and played the minimum amount of minutes merely to qualify for eligibility.

I say turn it down to 60. Players can have the most dominant season ever but then has played 64 games. For some of these guys they play like 77,78,79 games in the regular season and then their teams are qualified for the playoffs and then play their bench players for the rest of the games.

I would drop it by 5 games. I think 60 is a sweet spot