[Charania] This is an aggressive move for Phoenix and unlocks the franchise’s next six drafts – and most importantly, breaks up their lone tradable first in 2031 into three future firsts. The Suns now have tripled their first-rounders.
3 1sts > 1 1st math checks out
Just asked my numbers guy to make sure.
You’re right.
Big if true
It’s bigger than 1 but is it better than 2?
Thanks, I was just gonna ask my tax guy
“My nickel is bigger than your dime”-ahh trade.
Magic math right there
So now they have firsts in every year from 2025-2030, which I think means they can trade their own picks (much more valuable than the firsts from this trade) in 2026 and 2028.
We swapped those right?
Now you can outright trade those picks, just that it will be least favorable of all the teams it’s swapped to.
2026 pick is the worst of wizards/magic/suns, 2028 worst of wizards/nets/suns, 2030 worst of wizards/grizz/suns.
“We taught this chimpanzee to understand the Phoenix Suns’ swap right and pick protection stipulations and he hanged himself.”
Inspiring ✨
Basically just give the suns the pick between 25-30 for the next 5 years. Not sure how they will rebuild when the time comes, but it is going to be very tough.
Not that hard to rebuild to at least a playoff team when your owner has money to blow.
Suns trading out the leftover picks at the back of the fridge in their next trade
Can they trade 2030 since they dont have 2031?
Those swap rights were traded twice? I honestly dunno if these picks are worth more than the Phoenix picks now. This is a wild af trade
Half those picks are swaps already. They can trade them but the value is very low cause it would be the 2nd best pick of the 3 involved (suns get the 3rd, OG team gets the best).
Swappable low value pick is better than unswappable picks if you want to make a trade
I swear to God the suns are trying to get a Matt Ishiba rule instated similar to the Stephien rule. They’re doing everything they can to fuck their own draft picks and next 10 years up. ‘What if we get 3 20+ FRPs by trading an unprotected first 7 years out, which also allows us to trade our own valuable picks 5&3 years out, so we can get marginally better now, but will suck much worse when the pendulum swings back.
im shocked we didn’t do something like this with OKC. they have like 5 firsts next year + topic and will have 14 guys on their roster
If they don’t win a ring this year, I fully expect them to open up the warchest of picks to make a big splash.
Just better hope they don’t waste the year that everyone is healthy and SGA is at his peak. Windows can close fast
Let us ruin OKCs plan of winning this year.
I’m only okay with it if you lose to the Hawks in the finals
Wait your turn, peasant. We will ruin their plans FIRST of them sweeping us in the first round after we lose to them in 5 games.
All playoff teams plan on winning
I think this is what happens. SGA is so good tho that they could very well just win it this year
If we don’t win offseason will be interesting. As long as we can get salaries to somewhat work out. There’s like 5 players in the league we can’t trade for on pure asset value.
/r/thunder will be cooking up crazy trades on how we end up with prime MJ after we trade 11 frp to Father Time and then 15 more to the 95 bulls
We are trying to give them Johnson for Topic, Williams, and a random draft pick and they won’t budge.
They won’t even do Joe, Williams, two draft picks.
OKC are horders and don’t know how to make good trades to help their team during the season. Only draft, a simple offseason trade, and maybe free agency.
Worked pretty well for them so far I’d say
….. they’ve won what in the playoffs?
Lmao, we’re the youngest team in the nba and have been good for 1.5 seasons.
But we lost to the Mavs last postseason so clearly the rebuild strategy isn’t working. Fire Presti!
You should send us 4 FRPs for PJ Washington. OKC will be legit unstoppable with the Thunder Killer in the roster.
I’d send you 4 first rounders for you to send him to China.
Shit, I’d send you 4 first rounders and a couple of pick swaps for y’all to launch him into space
Ain’t nothing matter till you win in the playoffs but we can act like yall are regular season champs that’s fine
There’s no “act like”, we were 1 seed in the west last year and are top of the conference this year.
But you don’t win a championship until you win a championship, excellent observation. I agree.
Nice and the mavs are built to beat you in the playoffs…. That’s where shits differwnt. That’s why you trade some picks to win when you haven’t won before..
We’ll see. I’m not worried. I think our FO knows what they’re doing and I think they’ve done a great job so far.
Maybe worry a little more about your own guys.
I’m just a guy on the internet, but I would not make that trade from OKC’s perspective. I’m excited about Topic…giving him up plus a pick is more than I’d be comfortable doing for what will ultimately be a bench upgrade.
That said, it’s easy to argue the other way. Johnson could push the Thunder over the top this season.
Ill be honest, from watching Topic back in Serbia, I really don’t remember the last time we had a young guard playing at that level
Johnson would barely crack your starting 5 my dude
I’m sure OKC could find some minutes to give to a high volume 6’8 spacer when that’s probably one of the only areas that isn’t high level.
You would basically put a 30 mpg cap on everyone and the opposing team is always in a fresh hell
Not in the playoffs
Agreed. He’s a bench player for us when/if this team is healthy. The worst player in the projected starting 5 is Dort and Johnson isn’t taking his spot. I think he could be extremely helpful, but the trade is risky. What if he can’t defend at the necessary level to stay on the court? Every rotation player right now is a plus defender, which is part of why our defense is so good.
I don’t see why y’all should trade for Johnson at all. He’s a middling player at best.
If y’all really wanted to make a trade I’d say make a big splash, but you don’t have the contracts really.
Probably no action for the Thunder by the deadline. Y’all will do the same thing as last season tho, try to build in the offseason
I think we just really like our team and aren’t gonna make a trade unless it’s one sided.
Until Chet and Ihart play together it’s gonna be impossible to make a good decision on what’s needed. We’re unlucky that they were both hurt at different times.
They also have to be careful on the salary front because the young guys will eventually need to be paid.
All those picks can be great though for decent on year rentals to fill gaps in roster. Others they can use to maintain a talent pipeline, but they have to be careful there because the rookie scale feels really pricy for a non-contributor when paying luxury tax.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Presti thinks he fucked up with the Hayward trade last deadline and doesn’t want to do the same thing again.
The trade ultimately got them IHart, no?
Yeah, trade was definitely thinking long term and it worked.
But even though the trade was good, they still could have learned the lesson that chemistry is easy to disrupt in season
In Presti post season presser he spoke about not realizing how difficult it would be for a new player to integrate into a really good team mid season and said he’d learned from that.
Presti has said things in his presser’s before that hasn’t exactly lined up with his actions but was an interesting point he made.
I’m often a critic for OKC hoarding picks and having to sometimes dump them for nothing, but even so this seems like an overpay for Cam Johnson. Topic is pretty good
Interesting. Where did you hear this?
You have no idea what we will or won’t do lol the Thunder don’t leak
Which Williams are we talking about? Don’t they have like three guys on the roster with that name?
This is why OKC is unlikely to make much noise TBH. They should be offloading some of these pics. You literally play 8-9 guys a night…
Utah had the second-most amount of firsts and open to competing 6 years down the line, unlike OKC who are competing right now. The Jazz were the most obvious trading partner here.
Wait, you can bypass the Stephan Rule by having another team’s pick for that year?
Yes, you just need to have a pick. Doesn’t necessarily have to be yours
If a team were to be in a situation similar to Phoenix before this trade, and they committed some kind of tampering/etc violation that warranted forfeiting a 1st round pick, would the Stepien Rule prevent the league from enforcing that punishment in particular?
If you break the rules enough that the league is considering taking a 1st I don’t know why you would be protected so yes.
Yeah look at Minnesota’s punishment 20 years ago. Oof.
The league could probably still do it, the Stepien rule has been around since 1985 and when the Wolves got caught circumventing the Salary cap with Joe Smith their 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005 1st rounders were removed (they later got back 2003 and 2005 but 2001⁄2002 is still 2 years without a first rounder)
As long as you have a pick you make the the trade for the more favourable one.
Can someone ELI5 why phoenix’s draft picks were locked for 6 years prior to this trade and how this helps them now? Is it the Stepian rule? Even if it is, I’m not following how this “unlocks the next six drafts”?
It might be stepian combined with them getting 3 picks now alternating years so possibly creating 6 years worth of options they didnt have
Oh I see thanks, it unlocks the next 6 drafts because 3 of those drafts they can trade the picks that they just acquired and the other 3 are their own picks
They can now outright trade their swapped picks in alternate years, just as long as they have 1 first rounder every alternate year.
Although those are swapped multiple times over and these are least favorable of 3 teams too.
So not only did they trade their 2031 unprotected 1st, but they did it so they can trade more unprotected picks? Isiah Thomas must be overjoyed
This is an absurdly stupid deal from Ainge. What a bailout for Phoenix.
It wasn’t though. 3 picks that are essentially end of first round for a pick that potentially could be really good
Utah sucks. Minnesota is trending down. They’re banking on Cleveland pretty much. Because even 3 mid rounders for a 1st is absurd. Nobody knows where Phoenix will be in 2031.
At best, they traded 3 low firsts for a lottery pick. But there are many more scenarios that don’t pan out that way. 6 years is an eternity in the NBA.
Let’s put it this way. If the Suns made an offer to the Heat for these 3 picks plus Beal, you think they take it? Now what about the 2031 first? I bet they would take the former over the latter.
All 3 will likely be Cleveland. It’s the worst of the Cleveland/Utah/Minnesota picks. So they’ll still have Minnesota
Yea, it’s the worst of 3 different picks
When you have 3 picks in 1 year, it makes sense to try to consolidate to better picks
Even if the Suns get Butler, what are they going to look like in 2031?
Cleveland is really good this year, but there’s no guarantee that they will remain good. The NBA moves fast, not quite NFL speed, but faster than before.
Even if Cleveland regress, it’s unlikely that all 3 of those teams suck
This is starting to remind me of that unprotected 2021 pick that got traded so much and kept getting hyped up by fans years prior. Iirc the pick ended up being an underwhelming player.
Yup Miamis pick
Turns out Miami attracts vets
And outside of one Phoenix Saver incompetent decade, the suns have always brought in vet talent from outside. That’s the bet
And Miami also turned undrafted/2nd round players into actual contributing players
This will be huge
So far jj has a decent track record late in the draft
These picks are gambles. That’s all this is. When you’re gambling, you calculate the odds, and ODDS ARE PHX will be shit in 2031, and odds are Cavs will be really good for the next 5 years so they will be what’s conveyed. Anything can happen, but those are how those assets are going to be treated when it comes to value.
They are just splitting up this asset so they can disperse it’s value and now open up avenues to trade swaps. They can keep the 2029 pick, send one out with Nurk, send one if you get Butler.
It was a smart move for a constrained team. They know the trade climate better than any of us, while they make questionable moves they know what they’re trying to do (win) and know what other teams want from them.
I wouldn’t want any of those tbh. The 3 picks will probably be ass, the one is so far and a crapshoot.
Gun to my head I probably take the 3 just to have some volume to potentially trade for someone else. I’m not using any of those picks if so get them, they are all trade fodder.
Exactly, banking on one team to turn to shit when you can bank on 3 teams being subpar(and ones that have historically been subpar up until very recently) I would rather roll my dice with the 3. 3 assets is 3 opportunities for you or other GMs to gamble with vs just one.
The thing is all 3 will most likely be Cleveland’s since it’s out of those 3 teams the least valuable. So we’re talking like 3 28-30 level picks for what’ll probably be a Top 5 pick honestly
Pretty much an indicator that ainge will be with the jazz for a while, otherwise it’d make no sense for him to not discount the future, if he doesn’t have that job security however then yeah pretty silly
God knows what rosters will look like in 2031. 3 picks for 1, when it’s that far out it egregious. I’m calling this a fleece on day 1
well um, bc of the new cba, and the fact that we are clearly going to be in the 2nd apron for the foreseeable future, that pick is locked into the end of the round
(unless trading the pick negates that rule, im not sure if it does or not)
It negates it. AFAIK you couldn’t even trade that pick if it was frozen
Word on the street is KD and Jimmy are going to extend for cheaper over longer contracts worth the same money so that we will get under the 2nd apron.
Between getting a cheaper contract in Richards than okogie. Likely trading nurk for someone cheaper than him too.
Yes, this is part of getting them under the 2nd apron: lowering salaries as the cap rises. By 2031, and likely before, KD and JB will be gone and the Suns will have lots of money to spend, so the pick won’t hurt as much.
correct
Not how that works
yeah, i just learned that
put the wagons before the horse
I mean if minny doesn’t get better this year then it’s a middle of the draft pick
It’s least favorable of MIN or CLE so it’s probably going to be CLE who happen to be doing fairly well right now
Shit changes fast, 3 years ago Utah and suns were 1 and 2 seed
Oh right I mixed it up lol
It’s a great deal for Utah. They already have a shit ton of draft picks from the Mitchell/Gobert deals, plus a bunch of young guys they’re already trying to develop. Consolidating a bunch of mid first rounders into a premium pick like an unprotected 2031 first from an old ass team is a GREAT move.
The Jazz just drafted 3 rookies in Cody Williams, Isiah Collier and Kyle Filipowski last draft and have 3 more first round picks upcoming this year. They don’t need a bunch of more mid first round picks
Yeah honestly not too bad of a move for the Jazz. It’s an unprotected first that they got too, could use it for something else down the line.
It’s more like late first round picks as well. They need to start drafting better, though, or at least getting some better luck in the lottery.
Not really bad for Utah at all. It helps Phoenix in the short term, but doesn’t significantly alter their outlook for 2031, which is all Ainge cares about.
Utah can’t develop that many young guys anyway, might as well take the higher upside shot.
I agree, this is a good move for y’all - will help with the OKC-style future rebuild
Why?
3 picks from Cleveland the next few years seem like 20-30 every time?
It’s a gamble move. He’s assuming, maybe not unjustly, that. Phoenix is absolutely going to be a terrible dumpster fire by then and that will potentially be a likely top 5ish pic.
I’m not advocating for this trade, but I do think we get a little too hung up on the number of pics instead of looking at the quality of them.
If you have three pics that look likely to be in the late teens to late twenties, that’s very different value than say if you owned a single first-round pick from The wizards.
Whether it ends up being the right move or not, we won’t know for a long time. But I see the logic and what he’s trying to do
Cleveland has the best record in the league. Who even is in Phoenix by 2031?
It feels like he is searching for that Celtics/Nets deal again, which in fairness, did lead to a championship and lots of deep playoff runs. The Wolves and Cavaliers haven’t cratered the way those old Nets team did so the high end upside of those picks haven’t materialized and now he’s cashing part of them in for another upside play with the Suns.
That Gobert deal still looks excellent to me.
They have a crap ton of picks. This is just a lottery ticket.
Ainge went through this with the Celtics. When you have stacks of draft picks they lose value. With the Celtics he had more picks than roster spots. Other GMs knew and low balled him and he ended up wasting picks.
In 2016 he couldn’t find a consolidation deal that he liked so he tried draft and stash. Picked Yabu at 16 and Zicic at 23. It was a complete waste of first rounders. In hindsight he would have been much better consolidating and taking a swing at a future lottery pick.
Yup no idea why ainge would do this
Why are we still supporting a site owned by a Nazi?
Can we just talk about basketball? Plenty of subreddits for politics….
Huge for the Suns. Can’t believe they pulled this off
Late 1st rounders.
Triples is the best
What the fuck did they just do?
The NBA wants to see Jimmy Butler in Phoenix because there is no reason why Utah would make this trade.
Let Ishbia cook?
Crazy stuff! But can we please ban post X/Twitter? I’m not trying to support a Nazi.
Trump won get over it
Eat shit
Wait, how many picks does Utah have this year? What are the quality of these picks? It definitely gets em out of a hole, can look to trade away Beal/KD and rebuild
Man uses many words on stupid platform to say 3 is triple 1
Triples make it safe…triples is best.